Jocko Underground: My Career Choice is Haunting Me
In this Jocko Podcast episode, Echo Charles and Jocko Willink discuss the realities of military service through multiple perspectives. They examine experiences from a 2006-2007 deployment to Iraq's Al-Anbar Province, including combat operations, IED encounters, and sniper situations. The hosts also explore the enduring bonds formed during military training, exemplified by Jocko's continued connection with his BUD/S classmates.
The conversation addresses a common challenge faced by service members: dealing with career disappointments and unfulfilled military aspirations. Through the example of a service member who didn't complete Special Forces selection, Echo and Jocko examine how military personnel can come to terms with their service experiences. They discuss the importance of recognizing the value of all military contributions, regardless of specific roles or titles achieved.
This is a preview of the Shortform summary of the Aug 11, 2025 episode of the Jocko Podcast
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1-Page Summary
Military Training, Selection, and Experiences
In discussing military service experiences, Echo Charles and Jocko Willink explore a significant deployment to Al-Anbar Province, Iraq, during 2006-2007. The deployment involved intense combat scenarios, including encounters with IEDs and snipers in areas like Fallujah. The unit's exceptional performance earned them the Valorous Unit Award for their actions in firefights, counter-IED operations, and successful capture of high-value targets.
The conversation also touches on a service member's experience of failing Special Forces Selection. Despite preparing for a second attempt at the Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS), they ultimately chose to complete their service without returning to selection.
Camaraderie and Connections Among Military Service Members
Jocko shares personal insights about the lasting bonds formed during military service, reflecting on his own experiences with BUD/S Class 177. He describes how even years later, he and his fellow service members maintain their connection, signing off texts with "sevens" as a tribute to their shared experiences during training.
Regret and Disappointment in Military Career
Echo Charles addresses a service member's regret about not becoming a Green Beret by drawing an analogy to football positions, comparing less prominent but crucial roles like an offensive tackle to more visible positions. Jocko Willink builds on this by emphasizing that service value isn't determined by achieving specific titles like Green Beret or SEAL, but rather by the actual contributions made during service. He notes that many service members, regardless of their status or role, share similar feelings of wanting to do more, while encouraging focus on the positive impact of their service and post-military life achievements.
1-Page Summary
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Actionables
- You can create a personal valor award system to recognize your own achievements in challenging situations, similar to how military units receive commendations. Start by setting specific goals that, when achieved under difficult circumstances, warrant a self-awarded "valor point." Keep a journal or a digital tracker where you log these points, and set a reward for yourself once you reach a certain number. This could be a day off, a special purchase, or an experience you've been looking forward to, reinforcing the idea that overcoming personal battles is commendable.
- Develop a ritual or symbol that celebrates the shared experiences and bonds you have with a group, akin to Jocko's "sevens" tribute. This could be with former classmates, colleagues, or any group you've had significant experiences with. For example, if you and your college friends survived a particularly tough semester, you might all wear a bracelet with the semester's year or a charm representing your major. Whenever you meet up or talk, reference the symbol to reignite the camaraderie and shared memories.
- Reflect on your past roles and contributions in various aspects of life, and write a "service impact statement" that highlights the positive effects you've had, regardless of titles or recognition. This could be in your community, family, or workplace. For instance, if you volunteered at a local shelter, detail how your actions helped improve the lives of those you served. This exercise helps shift focus from titles and accolades to the actual value and impact of your efforts, fostering a sense of fulfillment and purpose.
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Military Training, Selection, and Experiences
The experiences of military service members, both in training and on deployment, highlight themes of dedication, sacrifice, and valor.
Military Service, Iraq Deployment, Special Forces Training
Served 7 Years In Army, Deployed Al-anbar, Iraq, 2006-2007, 3-509th Fought Al-qaeda
Echo Charles brings to light a deployment that took place in Al-Anbar Province in Iraq from 2006 to 2007, where the 3-509th inflicted significant damage on Al-Qaeda forces. Jocko Willink gives context to the deployment discussing the intense combat scenarios involving IEDs, snipers, and casualties in locations like Fallujah, while also highlighting the acts of heroism displayed by the service members during this period.
Failed Special Forces Selection, Trained For Return, Chose Not to Continue
The conversation shifts as a questioner reveals they had failed Special Forces selection earlier in their military career. Despite training for a possible return to the grueling Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS), the service member ultimately made the decision to leave the military (End Term of Service or ETS) before making a second attempt at SFAS.
Unit Earned Valorous Unit Award For Outstanding Performance During Deployment
Jocko Willink confirms that the questioner's unit, the 3-509th, was recognized for its excep ...
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Military Training, Selection, and Experiences
Additional Materials
Actionables
- You can develop resilience by setting and overcoming small, daily challenges. Start with something simple like a cold shower each morning or a daily puzzle that pushes you out of your comfort zone. Over time, increase the difficulty to build mental toughness, similar to how service members train for challenging situations.
- Enhance your problem-solving skills by participating in team-based strategy games or simulations. Games like paintball or escape rooms require quick thinking and adaptability under pressure, mirroring the need for versatility and courage in varying conditions.
- Cultivate a mindset of perseverance by creating a 'failure resum ...
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Camaraderie and Connections Among Military Service Members
Military service members often form profound bonds that last well beyond their time in service, due in large part to their shared experiences and identities.
Significance of Shared Experiences and Identities in Military
Narrator and Former Unit Members Maintain Connections and Identify by Shared Class Number, Even Years Later
Jocko, a veteran, reminisces about the connections that endure with his fellow service members from his Basic Underwater Demolition/SEAL (BUD/S) class. He recalls the pride they felt as a unit, symbolized by their class number, 177, inscribed on their helmets. Even years after serving, Jocko remains in contact with his "bros" from BUD/S Class 177. They keep the spirit of their shared experiences alive by signing off texts with "sevens," a gesture that both maintains and honors the connection they forged during their rigor ...
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Camaraderie and Connections Among Military Service Members
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Clarifications
- Basic Underwater Demolition/SEAL (BUD/S) class is a rigorous training program for Navy SEAL candidates. BUD/S is known for its demanding physical and mental challenges, designed to prepare individuals for the elite Navy SEALs. Candidates undergo intense training in areas like diving, land warfare, and weapons proficiency during the BUD/S course. The class number, such as "Class 177," signifies the specific group of candidates who start and complete the BUD/S training together. The bonds formed during BUD/S often last a lifetime due to the shared hardships and achievements experienced during the training.
- In military circles, "sevens" is a term used by Navy SEALs to symbolize their BUD/S class number, such a ...
Counterarguments
- While military camaraderie is often strong, it is not universal; some service members may feel isolated or disconnected from their peers.
- The significance of shared experiences can vary greatly among individuals; not all service members may find these experiences to be identity-defining.
- The use of symbols like the class number may not hold the same meaning for all members of a unit; some may not feel as attached to these symbols.
- Maintaining connections post-service can be challenging due to geographical separation, life changes, or personal circumstances, which can weaken the bonds formed during service.
- The narrative may not fully represent the diversity of experiences within the military, as some individuals may have had negative experiences that impact their view of military camaraderie.
- The ...
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Regret and Disappointment in Military Career
The questioner expresses a haunting sense of regret over not achieving the status of a Green Beret in their military career. This sentiment is paralleled by others who throughout their service have faced similar disappointments.
Narrator's Regret About Not Becoming a Green Beret
The Narrator Likens His Role To an Unsung Football Lineman Crucial To Team Success
Echo Charles empathizes with the narrator's regret and draws an analogy between military roles and positions in a football team. Charles understands the desire to be in a high-profile role and relates it to his own experience of wanting to be a wide receiver but instead becoming an offensive tackle—lacking the limelight yet being crucial to the team's success.
Jocko Willink Emphasizes Pride in Service, Valuing Contributions Over Unmet Goals
Jocko Willink addresses the narrator's feelings not by speaking directly to the regret but by framing a message that stresses pride in service and valuing the contributions made. Willink reassures the questioner that their service continues to be honorable and significant, regardless of not becoming a Green Beret. He acknowledges others with high-status titles, such as Green Berets, SEALs, and Rangers, who may not have the combat experience that the questioner has had.
Focus On Positive Impact and Life Built After Ser ...
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Regret and Disappointment in Military Career
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Actionables
- Reflect on your past achievements and write a gratitude letter to yourself, acknowledging the roles you've played and their impact. This exercise helps you recognize your own contributions, much like the military personnel who didn't become a Green Beret but still served honorably. For example, if you were part of a project team at work, write about the specific tasks you handled that helped achieve the team's goals, and how your work supported your colleagues.
- Create a 'Team Impact Map' by drawing a diagram that connects your role to the larger goals of your community or organization. This visual tool can help you see how even seemingly small tasks contribute to the bigger picture, similar to how every military role supports collective success. For instance, if you volunteer at a local shelter, map out how your efforts in organizing supplies lead to better support for those in need, which in turn strengthens community welfare.
- Start a 'Positive Impac ...
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