Podcasts > Jocko Podcast > 491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

By Jocko DEFCOR Network

In this episode of Jocko Podcast, Henry Sledge discusses his father Eugene Sledge's World War II experiences in the Pacific Theater, particularly during the battles of Peleliu and Okinawa. Through his research of his father's original manuscript at Auburn University, Henry provides new insights into Eugene's wartime experiences and the stark realities of combat that were documented in "With the Old Breed."

The conversation explores how Eugene's combat experiences affected his post-war life, including his struggles with PTSD and its impact on family relationships. Henry shares how his father viewed Hollywood's portrayal of war, his father's relationships with fellow Marines, and how writing helped Eugene process his trauma. The episode also covers Henry's own book, which incorporates previously unpublished materials to expand upon his father's story.

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491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

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491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

1-Page Summary

Eugene Sledge's World War II Experiences and Legacy

Eugene Sledge served in World War II's Pacific Theater, particularly in the brutal battles of Peleliu and Okinawa. His experiences, later documented in his memoir "With the Old Breed," provide a stark portrayal of war's reality and its lasting impact on soldiers.

Combat Experience and Survival

According to his son Henry, Eugene fought through some of the war's most intense battles, including the "forgotten battle" of Peleliu, where his division suffered nearly 4,000 casualties in the first week alone. Eugene described how the combat experience "eroded the veneer of civilization," while finding moments of humanity through respected figures like Lieutenant Edward "Hillbilly" Jones and Sergeant John Teskovich.

Henry Sledge's Research and New Perspectives

Henry Sledge, through careful analysis of his father's original manuscript at Auburn University, has uncovered additional details and perspectives not included in the published version of "With the Old Breed." His own book, "The Old Breed: The Complete Story Revealed," incorporates these previously unpublished materials to provide a more comprehensive understanding of his father's wartime experiences.

The podcast discusses the significant disconnect between media portrayals of war and soldiers' actual experiences. Henry Sledge notes that his father particularly disdained the jingoistic war movies of the 1950s for their failure to capture war's true nature. Eugene's memoir stands out for its raw honesty about combat conditions, including the physical hardships and psychological toll of constant danger.

Impact on Family Life

Eugene's wartime experiences profoundly affected his post-war life and family relationships. Henry recalls his father's struggles with PTSD, including nightmares and moments of emotional distance. Despite these challenges, Eugene managed to be a loving father while working through his trauma through writing. His wife learned to navigate his PTSD symptoms, seeking advice from other veterans on how to support him effectively.

1-Page Summary

Additional Materials

Actionables

  • You can deepen your understanding of the human side of war by starting a journal where you reflect on the personal stories of veterans. After reading memoirs or watching interviews, write down your thoughts on the emotional and psychological impacts of war, drawing parallels to your own life challenges and how you cope with them.
  • Create a small support network with friends or family where you openly discuss mental health, using insights from veterans' experiences to foster a safe space for sharing. This can help normalize conversations about PTSD and emotional well-being, much like Eugene's wife sought advice from other veterans.
  • Volunteer with organizations that support veterans, offering your time to listen to their stories or assist in community projects. This hands-on approach allows you to witness the long-term effects of war on individuals, similar to how Henry Sledge researched his father's experiences, and can provide a deeper appreciation for the sacrifices made by service members.

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491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

Eugene Sledge's World War II Experiences and Legacy

Eugene Sledge served in some of World War II's most brutal battles at Peleliu and Okinawa, facing significant trauma and loss, which he later chronicled in his memoir "With the Old Breed."

Eugene Sledge's Marine Experiences in the Pacific

Service at Peleliu and Okinawa: Enduring Trauma and Loss

Sledge fought with tenacity and maintained his humanity amid the savagery of war. He carried ammunition under heavy Japanese fire, as Willink mentions, and wrote about the extreme conditions and violence in his memoir. Henry Sledge, his son, notes that Eugene referred to Peleliu as the forgotten battle, and was bitter not because of his personal suffering, but for the fallen comrades who did not return home. Eugene described the horrific nature of the combat at Peleliu, saying, "Peleliu eroded the veneer of civilization and made savages of us all."

Sledge and his fellow Marines endured dangerous roles, such as a 17-year-old named Steele who volunteered as a flamethrower gunner and died trying to knock out a Japanese bunker. Sledge realized that the tough training was necessary to prepare them for the deadly combat situations they would face. He recounted the dangerous trek across an airfield at Peleliu, where both strategically important victories and traumatic experiences occurred, such as a fellow Marine being hit by shrapnel.

The preparation for the invasions included submarine reconnaissance, but valuable information like the depth of the water and type of shoal was not fully understood until right before landing. The Marines anticipated intense Japanese resistance, which Eugene described as an unrelenting barrage, making survival seem impossible. They advanced through sniper fire, artillery shells, and constant peril. Sledge often recalled the heightened tension and loneliness on the battlefield and the need to follow NCO orders to prevent mass casualties from mortar fire.

In the heat of battle, respected figures like First Lieutenant Edward "Hillbilly" Jones and Sergeant John Teskovich provided reassurance and a sense of fraternity. Eugene drew comfort from these brief moments of humanity, but eventually mourned their deaths. By the end of the first week at Peleliu, his division suffered nearly 4,000 casualties, leading to their replacement.

Henry Sledge visited Peleliu decades later, reflecting on the landings and experiences his father described, including deadly enemy resistance and the dread of crossing the island's airfield. On Okinawa, the introduction of fresh replacements showed the disparity between new soldiers and battle-hardened veterans. Eugene witnessed horrible sights, such as fellow Marines killed without the chance for retrieval due to enemy fire. He also detailed the immense stress of living under constant threat and the psychological toll it took on the troops.

The battles in places like Kunishi Ridge were filled with heroism and horror. Due to constant enemy attacks, including incidents with snipers and close combat, Sledge saw comrades di ...

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Eugene Sledge's World War II Experiences and Legacy

Additional Materials

Actionables

  • Explore historical empathy by writing a letter from the perspective of someone who lived through a significant event, like a soldier in WWII. This exercise can deepen your understanding of the human experience during times of conflict. Imagine their thoughts, feelings, and the sensory details of their environment to create a vivid, empathetic narrative.
  • Create a personal reflection journal where you document moments of resilience in your own life, drawing parallels to the endurance shown by individuals like Sledge. Use this as a tool to recognize your strengths and the importance of preparation for life's challenges, much like the rigorous training for combat.
  • Start a small book ...

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491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

"Henry Sledge's 'The Old Breed' and Research Process"

Henry Sledge, through a careful and personal review process, explores his father's unpublished memoir, aiming to honor his father’s legacy and share intimate perspectives of the Pacific campaign in World War II.

Henry Sledge's Review of His Father's Unpublished Manuscript

After acquiring the original unedited manuscript of his father, Eugene Sledge's memoir, kept in the archives at Auburn University and accessible only to family members, Henry Sledge analyzed this manuscript comparing it with the published version of "With the Old Breed," his father's renowned book.

Sledge's Analysis Adds Depth and Context to Father's Memoir

Henry went through the original manuscript, highlighting every part that was edited out in the predominant version with the goal of identifying content that could offer more depth to the story. In particular, Henry found additional details in the unedited manuscript, such as a man his father mentioned who was omitted from the published book, and insights into the selection process for carrying a flamethrower, which deviated from typical military norms. He interprets these materials as nearly forgotten narratives that demand acknowledgment and respect.

Sledge's Mission to Honor His Father's Legacy and Share Untold Marine Experiences

Henry speaks about Captain Haldane, whom his father, Eugene Sledge, served under and admired. His father's book is a part of the Marine OCS's required reading, and Henry emphasizes the leadership qualities it ascribes to officers like Haldane. "The Old Breed: The Complete Story Revealed" is Henry Sledge's own book that assembles notes, experiences, and sections from drafts that did not make it into the final version of his father's memoir.

Insights and Perspectives From Henry Sledge's Approach

Henry describes his rigorous editorial process which began in November 2021 to honor his father's legacy. His intention was not just to recapitulate the memoir but to bring new life and context to his father's experiences and portray the war as more than what was shown in "The Pacific" and "With the Old Breed."

Henry's reflections on his father's memoir explore conversations and moments before the battle that differ from commonly known portrayals of war. He references a contemplative scene between marin ...

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"Henry Sledge's 'The Old Breed' and Research Process"

Additional Materials

Actionables

  • You can explore your family's historical narratives by interviewing older relatives and documenting their stories. Start by setting up casual conversations with family members who have lived through significant historical events. Record these discussions with their permission, and take notes on the unique perspectives they offer. This personal history project not only preserves your family's legacy but also provides you with a deeper understanding of historical events through the eyes of your loved ones.
  • Create a personal journal that captures your reflections on historical events and their portrayal in media. As you read books, watch documentaries, or consume any media related to history, jot down your thoughts on how these narratives compare to the realities they represent. This exercise will enhance your critical thinking skills and help you appreciate the complexity of historical events beyond their popular portrayals.
  • E ...

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491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

War Portrayals vs. Soldiers' Experiences

The podcast discusses the significant disconnect between how war is portrayed in media and narratives versus the true experiences of soldiers, specifically the Marines, in combat situations.

Romanticizing or Glossing Over Wartime Realities in Narratives and Films

The speakers talk about how the portrayal of Iwo Jima in films and photos often has a faded look that fails to capture the vibrant colors of the actual location. They express concern that movie storylines and characters may be cut for dramatic purposes, leading to a glossed-over portrayal of war.

Sledge's Honest Account: Importance in Accurate Representation

Henry Sledge felt that the actor portraying his father captured the essence of the man, noting that nuances of fear were probably pretty close to the real experience. Willink adds that his combat experience cannot fully compare to what Eugene Sledge went through, illustrating the importance of accurate representation in media depictions of war.

A scene from "The Pacific" details the unpleasant tasks soldiers had to carry out, like cleaning oil drums for drinking water—accounts like these emphasize real and genuine hardships. Henry Sledge acknowledges the importance of his father's honest account challenging romanticized views often portrayed in mainstream films, recounting specific hardships, such as cleaning out oil drums that later made water taste like oil due to mismanagement. Eugene Sledge's memoir "With the Old Breed" documents these experiences and is referred to for depicting the war's physical and psychological impact accurately.

Combat Veterans' Experiences vs. Home Perceptions Disconnect

Henry Sledge refers to pre-invasion photography failing to reveal the complexity of terrain, such as at Peleliu, where the horrors of tragic loss of life contrasted with its current beauty. This implies a disconnect between what was experienced by soldiers and the sanitized version often portrayed or perceived by the public. Eugene Sledge's descriptions, like the continuous sheet of flame during the beach landing at Peleliu, overcome the common narrative that tends to romanticize or gloss over brutal war realities.

The War's Physical and Psychological Impact on Marines

Eugene Sledge's detailed descriptions, including the "cesspool" environment of Okinawa and the grueling conditions faced by Marines, contribute to a more accurate portrayal of soldiers' hardships. The grim realities of war witnessed and endured were often glossed over by a home front eager for tales of heroism, with details sometimes edited out for being too raw. Filth, deprivation, and fear characterized the daily life of soldiers far more than the occasional acts of daring.

Veterans' Struggle: Reconci ...

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War Portrayals vs. Soldiers' Experiences

Additional Materials

Actionables

  • You can read memoirs or diaries of soldiers from various conflicts to gain a personal perspective on the realities of war. By delving into these firsthand accounts, you'll encounter the unfiltered daily experiences of soldiers, which often include the mundane, terrifying, and raw aspects of military life that movies and novels may omit. For example, seek out diaries from World War I or letters home from Vietnam War soldiers, which can be found in libraries or online archives.
  • Start a book club focused on non-fiction war literature that avoids romanticism. This encourages a collective understanding and discussion about the true nature of war, beyond the heroics. Choose books that are known for their honest depictions, such as "With the Old Breed" by Eugene Sledge or "The Things They Carried" by Tim O'Brien, and facilitate discussions that contrast these narratives with popular war films or novels.
  • Engage with veteran-led organizations to listen to and share th ...

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491: A Better Understanding Of War, Leadership, and Life. With Henry Sledge.

War's Impact on Eugene Sledge and Family

The Sledge family's experiences reveal the profound and lasting effects of war on veterans and their loved ones. Eugene Sledge's combat experiences in World War II left an indelible mark on his character, relationships, and the way he approached life postwar.

Sledge's Processing of Wartime Trauma and Its Impact on Relationships and Outlook

Eugene Sledge’s difficulties in adjusting to civilian life are clear in the anecdotes shared by Henry Sledge. After returning from the war, Eugene would often sit in silence, staring at a wall, grappling with his thoughts. His grandmother's lack of understanding and her berating behavior contrasted with his grandfather's empathetic defense of Eugene's need for time and space. This dynamic within the family underscores some of the challenges that relationships undergo when a member returns from combat.

Henry recalls times when his father had nightmares, a stark reminder of the trauma that lingered in Eugene’s subconscious. Despite this, Eugene managed to compartmentalize his PTSD and was committed to keeping his turmoil away from his family. He cherished being a classic all-American father, bringing happiness and joy into their home.

Sledge’s past trauma did surface occasionally, as evidenced by his desensitized reaction to a squirrel's violent death on the road. He also seemed disengaged during certain moments and appeared haunted in photographs. Even his writing process—revisiting the war while authoring his memoir—acted as a bridge between his past and present, demonstrating the weight of his experiences.

Sledge's Emotional Breakdowns and Family's Support

Despite the warmth and normalcy Eugene Sledge brought to family life, his personal struggle with wartime memories persisted. Henry recounts how his father, affected by stress, would wake up in a cold sweat from nightmares, unsettling Eugene's wife. Seeking advice from veterans on how to best support Eugene, she was counseled not to startle him in his sleep due to the risk of violent reactions.

Eugene's ability to seek solace in a prophetic voice he heard during combat suggests he found personal ways to cope with the harrowing environment he endured. However, the enduring impact of his experiences, including the profound effect of the loss of fellow soldiers, left a mark that was difficult to fully comprehend.

The publication of "With the Old Breed" played a therapeutic role for Eugene, as connecting with fellow Marines over the phone brought him camaraderie and support. It was a medium through which he could share both the positive and traumatic memories from the war.

Sledge Family Navigating Postwar Life Challenges

Tension within the family emerged as they navigated the complexities of Eugene's reintegration. His grandmother' ...

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War's Impact on Eugene Sledge and Family

Additional Materials

Actionables

  • You can explore personal history through journaling to understand how past events shape your character. Start by writing about significant life events and reflect on how they've influenced your values and relationships. This practice can offer insights similar to how Eugene Sledge's memoir connected his past and present, helping you to process experiences and find growth.
  • Create a support network by reaching out to friends or joining a community group focused on a shared interest, like a local birdwatching club. This can provide a sense of camaraderie and belonging, akin to the therapeutic support Eugene found with fellow Marines. Engaging in activities that align with your passions can also aid in finding normalcy and balance in life.
  • Develop a perso ...

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