In this episode of The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F*ck Podcast, Mark Manson and Drew Birnie examine shame's role as an evolutionary survival mechanism and its effects on human behavior. They explore how shame manifests in the body, triggers specific brain regions, and leads to various coping responses, while discussing how early childhood experiences shape lifelong shame patterns.
The conversation covers different therapeutic approaches for addressing shame, from traditional Freudian psychoanalysis to modern methods like CBT and Internal Family Systems. Manson and Birnie also analyze how social media and technology have transformed the experience of shame in modern society, offering practical strategies—such as the Stoic "view from above" technique—for maintaining perspective when dealing with shameful experiences.
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Mark Manson explains that shame evolved as a crucial survival mechanism in prehistoric times, where group cohesion was essential for survival. According to Drew Birnie, this led to the "learning paradox of shame," where painful memories of shameful events help prevent future social transgressions.
Shame triggers physical responses in the body, including flushing and nausea. Birnie describes this as a "body hijack," noting that the brain processes social injuries similarly to physical ones, activating the anterior cingulate cortex and insula regions.
Shame can lead to various dysfunctional coping mechanisms. According to Nathanson's shame compass, people typically respond to shame through withdrawal, self-attack, avoidance, or attacking others. Manson and Birnie discuss how these responses can create self-reinforcing cycles of negative behavior.
Early childhood experiences significantly shape lifelong shame patterns. Birnie and Manson emphasize that children are particularly vulnerable to shame during self-recognition development (ages 2-3) and adolescence, when the brain undergoes rapid rewiring. These early experiences can create lasting impacts on self-concept and behavior into adulthood.
While Freudian psychoanalysis helped uncover unconscious emotions, it lacked solutions for managing them. Carl Rogers developed person-centered therapy, emphasizing radical acceptance and creating non-judgmental spaces for clients to confront their issues.
Modern approaches like Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) and Internal Family Systems (IFS) offer practical strategies for challenging shame-based thoughts. Brene Brown's work connects shame healing with principles similar to Alcoholics Anonymous, emphasizing vulnerability, ownership, and social support.
Technology has intensified shame by amplifying it globally. Manson illustrates this with the "Central Park Karen" incident, where a single confrontation led to severe life-altering consequences through social media exposure.
Social media algorithms disrupt traditional shame responses and influence values through selective content amplification. However, Birnie suggests using the Stoic "view from above" practice to gain perspective, while Manson recommends the "deathbed test" to evaluate the true significance of shameful events in life's broader context.
1-Page Summary
Shame is a complex emotional and behavioral system that is deeply embedded in human nature. Mark Manson describes life in prehistoric times as challenging, with survival dependent on group cohesion. Individuals who failed to adhere to the social norms or fulfill responsibilities risked not only their lives but could endanger the entire tribe. Manson explains that shame evolved as a mechanism to prevent social violations sensitive to the life-or-death stakes of prehistoric life. This sensitivity to social expectations has been a crucial survival tool, as social rejection in those times could mean death.
Humans are biologically predisposed to avoid actions that might lead to ostracization due to the critical nature of group belonging in prehistoric times. Drew Birnie discusses the "learning paradox of shame," which reinforces social norms through a painful memory of a shameful event, thereby preventing future social transgressions. Both Birnie and Manson stress the evolutionary significance of shame in fine-tuning human behavior to survive within the tribe.
Shame triggers a pain response in humans, causing not only psychological distress but also manifesting as physical discomfort, flushing, nausea, and a host of other involuntary reactions.
The body's automatic response to shame includes visible signs such as blushing and changes in posture. Birnie explains this "body hijack" and physical manifestations as a response to the pain and discomfort associated with shame. The anterior cingulate cortex processes social injuries similarly ...
The Evolutionary and Biological Foundations of Shame
Shame is a complex emotion with far-reaching consequences on individual behavior and self-perception. Both Manson and Birnie delve into the intricacies of shame from its early onset to the coping mechanisms one may adopt.
Manson discusses how shame can drive one to avoid certain areas of their life, leading to isolation and harmful impacts on relationships. This avoidance is a form of coping, where individuals may engage in numbing or distracting behaviors like substance abuse or compulsive activities to escape feelings of shame. Toxic shame, Manson and Birnie note, is where a person believes they are inherently bad rather than having done something bad, spiraling into feelings of worthlessness.
Birnie distinguishes between state shame, which is a temporary emotion that motivates self-improvement, and trait shame, which is a permanent self-view. He clarifies that shame is distinct from embarrassment and humiliation, with the latter not carrying shame's internal feeling of worthlessness, and embarrassment being a less severe, shared moment that doesn't implicate one's character.
According to Nathanson's shame compass, there are four ways people respond to shame: withdrawal, attack self, avoidance (distraction or numbing), and attack others. Such responses can become self-reinforcing cycles if not addressed. For instance, Manson mentions past behaviors of aggression as a defensive mechanism to shame, whereas Birnie reflects on his perfectionism leading to self-attack when he perceives failure.
The speakers underscore the importance of recognizing the manifestations of shame, like physical sensations of blushing or nausea, cognitive thoughts of worthlessness, or behavioral responses such as hiding or lashing out.
These coping strategies often lead to a vicious cycle. Shame provokes behaviors that, in turn, result in more shame. For example, a person may feel unworthy of good things and consequently sabotage positive situations, perpetuating a negative self-narrative.
Birnie and Manson address how early experiences with shame can have a significant and lasting impact on a person. They suggest that family plays a vital role in a child's emotional development, with early shame experiences often leading to lifelong shame patterns.
Children, especially around the ages of two to three, are highly vulnerable to shame as they develop self-recognition. Negative feedback during this stage, such as being labeled as "bad," can lead to the internalization of toxic shame. As these children grow older, the narratives they've been told about themselves, whether it's about body image, abilities, or behaviors, can solidify, influencing their self-concept and behaviors into adulthood.
Adolescence is a period marked by heightened sensitivity to shame due to the rapid rewiring of the brain and the focus on social standing. The hosts discuss how the brain uses early experiences to understand one's environment, thereby setting the stage for how shame is managed later in life.
Manson and Birnie touch upon the concept that deeply shameful or traumatic experiences during formative years can bind emotional growth to those stages. Thus, behaviors in adults sometimes mirror the emotional responses developed in their youth, indicating an unresolved shame that transcends into adulthood.
The conversations reveal how unresolved childhood shame can translate into adulthood, affecting identity a ...
The Psychological and Behavioral Manifestations of Shame
Freudian psychoanalysis, originated by Freud, revolved around bringing unconscious thoughts and emotions like shame into awareness. Freud noticed a healing effect when individuals became aware of their internal impulses and could articulate them, feeling liberated. However, he did not devise a strategy to manage these emotions, noticing patients left therapy due to the discomfort the released emotions caused. Mark Manson adds that re-parenting emerged as a response to uncovering this "ugly mess" of shame without solutions. The usefulness of a Freudian approach lies in helping bring unconscious aspects of shame to the surface, particularly beneficial for those who have experienced early shame. Therapists in the '70s and '80s revisited Freudian psychoanalysis, delving into repressed memory work.
Carl Rogers, informed by Freud, recognized the issue of uncovering emotions without solutions. He developed an approach that focused on what to do with dug-up emotions and repressed shame. Rogers founded person-centered therapy on the belief that people tend to heal and grow in the right emotional environment. His method was patient-directed, building radical, unconditional acceptance into therapy, creating a non-judgmental space for clients to express themselves. This approach allowed clients to self-accept and safely confront their issues.
Modern therapies, such as Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) and Internal Family Systems (IFS), have developed to challenge shame-based thoughts and beliefs. CBT reframes shame-inducing beliefs, while IFS engages in "parts" dialogue to resolve emotional conflicts. These modern therapies integrate disowned parts of the self, offering strategies to detach from and address shame constructively. For example, Manson notes that engaging in CBT could include challenging cognitive distortions, and IFS might involve asking oneself what ...
Therapeutic Modalities and Approaches For Overcoming Shame
The narrative highlights how technology and social media have intensified the experience of shame by amplifying its reach globally, disrupting the traditional shame response, and potentially reshaping personal values and self-concept.
Technology scales shame to a global level, effectively turning the entire planet into one's tribe and magnifying shaming potential. Our brains process interactions on platforms like Instagram or TikTok as if they're with members of our collective group, which triggers primal moral mechanisms causing shame to spiral.
Mark Manson cites the incident of a woman dubbed the "Central Park Karen," whose confrontation in Central Park went viral. She faced severe repercussions, including loss of job, friends, apartment, doxxing, death threats, and ultimately moving to a different country. This encapsulates "shame on steroids," where any social misstep can scale across thousands or millions of people due to technology.
Online content permanence and "cancel culture" intensify the consequences of social infractions. Stories, like that of Tyler Clementi, who was secretly filmed, or "Central Park Karen," illustrate the significant, sometimes life-altering, repercussions driven by online permanence. Audience collapse raises the stakes for online behavior, as employers scrutinize social media profiles. The eternal nature of online content leads to risk aversion in real life, with people fearing that any mistake might be immortalized online.
Social media alters the traditional response to shame by stressing social infractions through algorithms, selectively amplifying certain behaviors and values. Manson describes how the brain is affected by social media, noting how these platforms inadvertently guide the adoption of certain morals and values by what and whom users choose to follow.
The act of engaging with online content and selecting who to follow is constructing a personal online tribe. By subscribing to specific individuals and ideas, one unconsciously adopts associated values and norms. The various audiences on platforms like Facebook create a singular audience for one’s shame system, influencing how individuals present themselves online. It's important to be mindful of this persona curation because it shapes self-concept without the user's conscious awareness.
Engaging in the physical world can mitigate the shame experienced through technolo ...
Influence of Technology and Social Media on Shame
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