#2420 - Chris Masterjohn
In this episode of The Joe Rogan Experience, Chris Masterjohn explores the role of mitochondria in human health and aging. He explains how mitochondrial function affects energy levels, anxiety, sleep quality, and other bodily functions, while discussing specific dietary factors and supplements that can support mitochondrial health, including creatine and CoQ10.
The conversation covers the effects of different fats on mitochondrial function, with particular attention to seed oils and their potential impact on heart health. Masterjohn examines historical assumptions about cholesterol and heart disease, discussing how past research may have led to misleading dietary recommendations. The discussion also touches on interventions like red light therapy and its benefits for vision and cognitive function.
This is a preview of the Shortform summary of the Nov 29, 2025 episode of the The Joe Rogan Experience
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1-Page Summary
Mitochondrial Function: Importance For Health, Energy, Aging
Chris Masterjohn explores the critical role of mitochondria in human health and aging. He explains that mitochondrial function naturally declines by about 1% annually after age 18, though aging only accounts for 25% of mitochondrial function—the rest depends on lifestyle choices. This decline affects energy levels, anxiety, sleep quality, and various bodily functions.
Masterjohn emphasizes that healthy mitochondria are essential for maintaining abundant energy, low anxiety, high libido, and deep sleep. He notes that CoQ10 supplements can aid mitochondrial function, while proper sleep allows mitochondria to replenish energy reserves.
Dietary Factors That Impact Mitochondrial Function
The discussion delves into specific dietary factors affecting mitochondrial health. Masterjohn highlights creatine's importance in supporting energy production and distribution, noting its ability to combat negative effects of sleep deprivation and aid in brain injury recovery.
Regarding dietary fats, Masterjohn warns about the harmful effects of seed oils on mitochondria, explaining how they can impede nutrient absorption and contribute to inflammation. He also emphasizes the connection between thyroid health and mitochondrial function, stressing the importance of nutrients like iodine, selenium, and protein for optimal thyroid performance.
Nutrients and Supplements: Impact on Cognition, Vision, and Wellness
The conversation shifts to specific interventions for improving mitochondrial health. Joe Rogan shares his success with red light therapy and specific supplements in improving his vision and stopping macular degeneration. Masterjohn elaborates on how red light therapy enhances mitochondrial energy production, particularly benefiting eyesight and cognitive function.
Historical Debate: Cholesterol, Heart Disease, and Dietary Fats
Masterjohn challenges historical assumptions about cholesterol and heart disease, particularly regarding the role of seed oils. He points to evidence suggesting that while seed oils lower cholesterol levels, they may actually increase the risk of heart disease by promoting plaque formation. He discusses how biased research and conflicts of interest in the 1950s-1980s led to misleading dietary recommendations that favored seed oils over traditional fats.
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Additional Materials
Counterarguments
- While CoQ10 is often touted for its benefits to mitochondrial function, some studies suggest that its effectiveness may vary among individuals, and it may not be a necessary supplement for everyone, especially if they are not deficient.
- The role of creatine in supporting mitochondrial function is well-documented, but its benefits can be limited if not paired with resistance training or if an individual's diet is already rich in creatine from sources like red meat and fish.
- The negative effects of seed oils on health are debated, with some research suggesting that the quality and processing of the oils, as well as the overall dietary context, are significant factors in determining their health impact.
- The connection between thyroid health and mitochondrial function is complex, and while iodine, selenium, and protein are important, over-supplementation or imbalanced intake can lead to thyroid dysfunction.
- Red light therapy has shown promise in some studies for various health benefits, but evidence is not conclusive for all claimed benefits, and responses can be individualized.
- The relationship between dietary fats, cholesterol, and heart disease is multifaceted, and while some studies have criticized seed oils, others have found that when consumed in moderation and as part of a balanced diet, they may not pose significant health risks.
- Historical perspectives on cholesterol and heart disease continue to evolve, and while some research from the mid-20th century may have been biased, modern studies also suggest that the relationship between dietary fats and heart disease is not as straightforward as once believed.
Actionables
- You can enhance your mitochondrial health by incorporating a weekly meal plan rich in iodine, selenium, and protein. Start by researching foods high in these nutrients, such as seafood for iodine, Brazil nuts for selenium, and lean meats for protein. Plan your meals to include these ingredients, aiming for a balanced intake throughout the week to support thyroid and mitochondrial function.
- Create a "mitochondria-friendly" kitchen by replacing seed oils with alternatives like olive oil, coconut oil, or butter for cooking. Begin by identifying all the products in your pantry that contain seed oils and gradually phase them out. Experiment with different recipes that use these healthier fats to find tasty options that don't compromise on flavor while promoting better mitochondrial health.
- Develop a personalized evening routine that promotes optimal sleep for mitochondrial recovery. This could involve setting a consistent bedtime, creating a pre-sleep ritual that includes activities like reading or meditation, and optimizing your sleep environment by adjusting lighting, temperature, and noise levels. Track your sleep quality and energy levels to fine-tune your routine for the best results.
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Mitochondrial Function: Importance For Health, Energy, Aging
Chris Masterjohn discusses the pivotal role of mitochondria in energy production and how their decline can impact health, aging, and overall well-being.
Mitochondria: Cells' Powerhouse, Producing Vital Energy
Mitochondria are known as the powerhouse of the cells, producing the energy necessary for maintaining, repairing, and running our bodily functions throughout our lives.
Mitochondrial Decline With Age Causes Health Issues
Masterjohn equates mitochondrial decline with aging, emphasizing that decreased mitochondrial function is at the root of aging. Research indicates that mitochondrial function drops by an average of one percent per year from the age of 18, meaning that by age 70, individuals have approximately half the energy they did at age 18. This progressive decline is natural in aging, but Masterjohn suggests that age only accounts for 25 percent of mitochondrial function, implying that lifestyle and health choices have a considerable impact on mitochondrial health.
Mitochondrial Health Is Key for Energy, Calmness, Libido, and Sleep
Mitochondrial Dysfunction Causes Fatigue, Anxiety, Poor Sleep
Mitochondrial dysfunction can result in various symptoms, including fatigue, anxiety, and poor sleep. Masterjohn emphasizes that anxiety might not stem from low energy levels but rather from losing control over energy distribution. Healthy mitochondrial function is characteristic of having abundant energy for productivity, low anxiety, high libido, deep sleep, and being energized when needed.
CoQ10 is highlighted as beneficial, functioning as a part of the mitochondrial transport pathway that helps convert food extracts into ATP and aiding mitochondrial biogenesis, the creation of new mitochondria. Moreover, the energy production in mitochondria signals the brain states of abundance, influencing digestion, libido, and other body functions.
Additionally, Masterjohn points out that mornings signal to mitochondria to begin ramping up energy production and that exercise, particularly endurance exercise, is vital for signaling the need for more mitochondria.
Further underlining the overarching importance of mitochondria, Masterjohn n ...
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Mitochondrial Function: Importance For Health, Energy, Aging
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Clarifications
- Mitochondria are small structures inside cells that generate energy by converting nutrients into a molecule called ATP, which powers cellular activities. They have their own DNA, allowing them to replicate independently within the cell. Besides energy production, mitochondria regulate cell metabolism and help control cell death. Their efficiency directly affects how well cells and organs function.
- ATP stands for adenosine triphosphate, a molecule that stores and transfers energy within cells. It acts as the primary energy currency, powering nearly all cellular activities. Mitochondria produce ATP by converting nutrients from food through a process called cellular respiration. Without sufficient ATP, cells cannot perform essential functions, leading to fatigue and impaired health.
- Mitochondrial biogenesis is the process by which cells create new mitochondria. It involves the growth and division of existing mitochondria to increase their number and improve energy production. This process is regulated by specific genes and proteins that respond to signals like exercise or cellular energy needs. Enhancing mitochondrial biogenesis can improve overall cellular function and energy levels.
- CoQ10, or coenzyme Q10, is a molecule found within the inner membrane of mitochondria. It plays a critical role in the electron transport chain, transferring electrons between complexes to help generate ATP, the cell’s main energy currency. CoQ10 also acts as an antioxidant, protecting mitochondrial membranes from damage caused by free radicals. Additionally, it supports the creation of new mitochondria, enhancing overall cellular energy capacity.
- Mitochondrial energy production generates ATP, the cell’s energy currency, which supports brain functions and neurotransmitter balance. When energy is abundant, the brain interprets this as a signal of safety and resource availability, promoting calmness and positive mood. This state encourages behaviors linked to growth and reproduction, like digestion and libido. Conversely, low energy signals stress, triggering anxiety and conservation responses.
- Mitochondria produce ATP, the energy currency cells use to perform functions. Energy distribution control means mitochondria regulate how much ATP is available in different tissues based on demand. This regulation ensures organs like muscles or the brain get energy when needed. It also influences signaling pathways that coordinate bodily functions beyond just energy supply.
- Mitochondria produce the energy needed for liver cells to process and remove cholesterol from the bloodstream. Efficient mitochondrial function supports the synthesis of bile acids, which help eliminate cholesterol. When mitochondria are impaired, cholesterol clearance slows, leading to higher blood cholesterol levels. Thus, healthy mitochondria are essential for maintaining cholesterol balance and cardiovascular health.
- Mitochondria generate reactive oxygen species as byproducts, which can damage their own DNA and proteins. Efficient self-repair mechanisms fix this damage to maintain mitochondrial function. When repair is inefficient, damaged mitochondria accumulate, reducing energy production and increasing harmful molecules. ...
Counterarguments
- The decline in mitochondrial function with age is not always linear or predictable, and individual variations can be significant.
- While lifestyle and health choices are important, genetic factors also play a significant role in mitochondrial health and aging, which is not mentioned in the text.
- The assertion that anxiety might stem from losing control over energy distribution is an oversimplification, as anxiety has multifactorial causes including psychological, environmental, and genetic factors.
- The benefits of CoQ10 are not universally accepted, and some studies suggest that its effectiveness may vary among individuals and conditions.
- The idea that mornings signal mitochondria to ramp up energy production is an oversimplification, as circadian rhythms and energy demands are complex and influenced by numerous factors beyond the time of day.
- The emphasis on endurance exercise for mitochondrial health may overlook the benefits of other types of exercise, such as resistance training, which have also been shown to improve mitochondrial function.
- The link between mitochondrial function and cholesterol clearance is not fully established, and chol ...
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Dietary Factors That Impact Mitochondrial Function
Chris Masterjohn and Joe Rogan discuss various dietary factors that influence mitochondrial function, underscoring the role of nutrients like creatine, the impact of seed oils, and the significance of thyroid health.
Creatine Supports Mitochondrial Energy Production and Distribution
Creatine Combats Sleep Deprivation's Negative Cognitive Effects
Masterjohn highlights the importance of creatine in supporting mitochondrial energy production and distribution, mentioning a study where creatine supplementation showed to prevent suffering in the brain from sleep deprivation. Research on traumatic brain injury is mentioned, with findings that 20 grams of creatine for six months can double the rate of healing. The creatine system is fundamental to cells with fluctuating energy demands, aiding in functions from pumping stomach acid to aiding sperm motility. Rogan suggests that creatine could enhance healing from brain injury, supporting mitochondrial function. When subjects in a study received creatine, they performed better on puzzles and complained less about fatigue compared to those on placebos.
Seed Oils Harm Mitochondria, Contributing To Inflammation and Disease
Studies: Seed Oils Raise Cancer, Mortality Risk vs. Traditional Fats
Masterjohn indicates that seed oils could decrease the conversion of beta carotene into vitamin A, impacting mitochondrial function. Rogan and Masterjohn discuss how seed oils may impede nutrient absorption and contribute to inflammation. Industrial processes using chemicals like hexane in making seed oils, opposed to the natural crushing of olives for olive oil, are contrasted. Seed oils make tissues more vulnerable to damage, affecting vitamin E levels and increasing susceptibility to tissue destruction. The discussion extends to how damaged particles, loaded with seed oils, lead to inflammation and plaques in blood vessels as the immune system tries to protect them. Masterjohn cites a study suggesting that long-term consumption of seed oils may be linked to cancer and recommends avoiding high quantities of polyunsaturated fats from such oils due to potential harmful effects.
Thyroid Health Links to Mitochondrial Function and Metabolic Status
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Counterarguments
- Creatine is generally considered safe, but there is a possibility that high doses over long periods could potentially cause kidney damage in susceptible individuals, and not all studies have found creatine to be effective in improving cognitive function.
- The impact of seed oils on health is a contentious topic, with some research suggesting that when consumed in moderation and as part of a balanced diet, they may not be as harmful as suggested, and the oxidation of polyunsaturated fats may depend on the cooking method and storage conditions.
- The link between seed oil consumption and increased cancer risk is not conclusively established, as many studies are observational and cannot prove causation; other lifestyle and genetic factors may also play a significant role.
- While thyroid health is important for metabolic function, the relationship between diet and thyroid health is complex, and dietary interventions alone may not be sufficient for individuals with thyroid disorders, who may require medication.
- The recommendation to eat "nose to tail" may not be suitable for everyone, considering dietary preferences, ethical beliefs, and the environmental impact of meat consumption; alternative nutrient sources may be necessa ...
Actionables
- You can enhance your cognitive function and energy levels by incorporating a creatine-rich diet or considering a creatine supplement after consulting with a healthcare professional. Start by adding creatine-rich foods like fish, red meat, and poultry to your meals, and if you're considering supplementation, seek advice to ensure it aligns with your health needs and to determine the appropriate dosage.
- To improve your thyroid and mitochondrial health, try adopting a "nose to tail" eating approach by including a variety of organ meats and other animal products in your diet. Begin by slowly introducing organ meats such as liver, heart, and kidney into your meals, which can be ground and mixed with more familiar meats if you're new to the taste, providing a full spectrum of nutrients that support thyroid function.
- You can reduce the potential ...
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Nutrients and Supplements: Impact on Cognition, Vision, and Wellness
Nutritional expert Chris Masterjohn delves into how certain supplements and therapies can positively influence cognitive performance, vision, and overall wellness.
Creatine Benefits Cognitive Performance During Sleep Deprivation
Creatine's role as a multifunctional supplement extends to cognitive health, particularly during sleep deprivation.
Creatine Distributes Energy Body-Wide, Including To the Brain
Masterjohn discusses that while creatine is widely recognized as a performance enhancer for athletes, it also shows promise in supporting cognitive functions during sleep deprivation. The mechanism behind this involves creatine's role in distributing energy throughout the body, including the brain. This distribution is likened to a power grid that makes energy available where it's needed most, which can be especially important when sleep is less than sufficient. Creatine's support for cognitive performance is especially relevant for individuals recovering from traumatic brain injuries. Although some users report insomnia, potentially linked to creatine's energy-boosting effects, utilizing the supplement earlier in the day might help mitigate such side effects while still providing cognitive benefits.
Masterjohn also suggests that combining creatine with other nutrients like CoQ10, which is involved in mitochondrial energy control, could further strengthen cognitive abilities when adequate rest is not an option.
Red Light Therapy Boosts Mitochondria, Enhancing Vision and Functions
Red light therapy's impact on vision and cognitive functions is rooted in its systemic enhancement of mitochondrial energy.
Red Light Therapy Enhances Eyesight By Boosting Mitochondrial Energy
Joe Rogan shares his experience with using a red light bed along with specific supplements, which not only halted his macular degeneration but also improved his vision. He attributes these improvements to Macular Support, a supplement that includes lutein among other vision-beneficial ingredients.
Masterjohn expands on the subject, emphasizing the synergistic effects of CoQ10 and red light therapy on mitochondrial function. The discussion further explores how exposure to red and infrared light, particularly during morning hours, can enhance mitochondrial health without the risks of sunburn. These improvements in mitochondrial function can translate to better reaction times—a form of cognitive exercise—and to maintaining memory and creative synthesis.
Iodine: Essential for Thyroid and Metabolism Regulation
Masterjohn highlights iodine's critical role in maintaining thyroid health and metabolic balance.
Iodine Defic ...
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Nutrients and Supplements: Impact on Cognition, Vision, and Wellness
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Clarifications
- Creatine stores high-energy phosphate groups in the form of phosphocreatine, which rapidly regenerates ATP, the primary energy molecule in cells. In the brain, this system helps maintain energy supply during periods of high demand or stress, such as sleep deprivation. By buffering and transporting energy, creatine supports neuronal function and cognitive processes. This energy buffering is crucial because the brain has limited energy reserves and relies on continuous ATP production.
- CoQ10, or coenzyme Q10, is a natural antioxidant found in the mitochondria, the cell's energy producers. It plays a key role in the electron transport chain, helping convert nutrients into ATP, the main energy currency of cells. By supporting efficient energy production, CoQ10 helps maintain cellular function and reduces oxidative damage. Its levels can decline with age or illness, making supplementation beneficial for mitochondrial health.
- Mitochondria are tiny structures inside cells that produce energy by converting nutrients into a molecule called ATP, which powers cellular activities. They are often called the "powerhouses" of the cell because they generate most of the cell's usable energy. Mitochondria also help regulate cell metabolism and play roles in cell signaling and survival. Their proper function is essential for overall health, especially in energy-demanding organs like the brain and muscles.
- Red light therapy uses specific wavelengths of red and near-infrared light to penetrate cells and stimulate mitochondria, the cell's energy producers. This stimulation increases the production of adenosine triphosphate (ATP), enhancing cellular energy and function. Unlike sunlight, red light therapy does not emit harmful ultraviolet (UV) rays, reducing the risk of skin damage or sunburn. It provides targeted mitochondrial support without the risks associated with prolonged sun exposure.
- Mitochondria produce the energy cells need to function, especially in energy-demanding brain cells. Efficient mitochondrial function supports faster neural signaling, improving reaction time. Adequate energy supply also aids memory formation by supporting synaptic plasticity. Creativity benefits from optimal brain metabolism, enabling complex cognitive processes.
- Macular degeneration is an eye disease that damages the central part of the retina, leading to loss of central vision. Lutein is a carotenoid antioxidant that accumulates in the retina, protecting it from harmful light and oxidative stress. Supplements with lutein and similar nutrients help maintain retinal health and may slow vision loss. These nutrients support the eye's natural defenses and improve visual function.
- Iodine is a key component of thyroid hormones, which regulate how the body uses energy. Without enough iodine, the thyroid cannot produce these hormones effectively, leading to slowed metabolism. This can cause symptoms like fatigue, weight gain, and goiter (thyroid enlargement). Adequate iodine intake is essential for normal growth, development, and metabolic function.
- Iodine is essential for producing thyroid hormones, which regulate metabolism. Without enough iodine, the thyroid cannot make sufficient hormones, leading to hypothyroidism. Hypothyroidism slows metabolic processes, causing symptoms like fatigue, weight gain, and cold intolerance. This deficiency can disrupt the body's energy balance and overall health.
- Iodine deficiency was once widespread, causing goiter and developmental issues. In the early 20th century, many countries introduced iodine into table salt to prevent these problems. This fortification dramatically reduced iodine deficiency disorders worldwide. However, recent reductions in salt intake and changes in food processing have led to a resurgence of iodine deficiency in some populations.
- Iodine is commonly added to table salt in a process called iodization to prevent ...
Counterarguments
- Creatine may not benefit cognitive performance in all individuals, and its efficacy can vary based on individual differences in metabolism and brain chemistry.
- The claim that creatine acts like a power grid may oversimplify the complex biochemical pathways involved in energy distribution and utilization in the body.
- While creatine has been studied in the context of traumatic brain injury recovery, more research is needed to fully understand its long-term effects and potential benefits in this area.
- The suggestion to take creatine earlier in the day to avoid insomnia may not be effective for all users, as individual responses to supplements can vary.
- The combination of creatine with CoQ10, while theoretically beneficial, may not have a significant impact on cognitive abilities without adequate sleep, as sleep deprivation has profound and well-documented negative effects on cognitive function.
- The benefits of red light therapy, while promising, are not universally accepted in the scientific community, and more rigorous, peer-reviewed studies are needed to confirm its efficacy for vision and cognitive functions.
- Joe Rogan's personal experience with red light therapy and vision supplements is anecdotal and may not be generalizable to the wider population.
- The role of iodine in thyroid health is well-established, but the prevalen ...
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Historical Debate: Cholesterol, Heart Disease, and Dietary Fats
The historical debate concerning cholesterol, heart disease, and dietary fats has been intense and multi-faceted, with new evidence reshaping our understanding of these interrelated health issues.
Biased Research and Conflicts of Interest Influenced Cholesterol-Heart Disease Link, 1950s-1980s
Key Studies Concealed Seed Oils As Primary Atherosclerosis Driver
Joe Rogan mentions the longstanding demonization of saturated fats since a pivotal study in the 1950s or 60s, where scientists allegedly received bribes from the sugar industry to shift the blame from sugar to fat. Chris Masterjohn cites Time magazine's 1984 cover story that advised against consuming cholesterol based on biased research, which misled society about dietary fats, leading to increased consumption of margarine and seed oils over traditional fats like butter. Masterjohn also points out a 1984 NIH consensus conference that wrongly attributed the cause of heart disease to cholesterol, which in turn influenced these public dietary recommendations. He shares skepticism about the principal investigators of NIH-funded studies, suggesting a closed loop of grant awards that may have perpetuated this misguidance.
The speakers discuss the overlooked historical studies from the '50s, '60s, and '70s, which were long-term and now suggest that proponents of seed oils ignored certain data. They discuss the LA Veterans Administration Hospital study that initially showed a slight heart disease benefit from seed oils that wore off over time, and by the end of that study, traditional fats were favored as the seed oils were associated with an increased death rate.
Youth Cholesterol Predicts Future Heart Risk; Seed Oils Lower Cholesterol but May Increase Plaque
Chris Masterjohn indicates that having a higher cholesterol level in one's youth prospectively predicts a higher heart disease risk in the future, reflecting a sluggish metabolism rather than a direct causation by cholesterol. He elaborates that seed oils, while lowering blood cholesterol levels, might increase easily damaged fatty acids that contribute to atherosclerotic plaque development, thereby increasing the risk of heart disease despite the lowered cholesterol levels.
Oxidized Seed Oils, Not Cholesterol, Major in Atherosclerosis
Masterjohn postulates that oxidized seed oils, not cholesterol, play a significant role in atherosclerosis. He describes the atherosclerotic process as one in which the i ...
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Historical Debate: Cholesterol, Heart Disease, and Dietary Fats
Additional Materials
Counterarguments
- The link between saturated fats and heart disease is supported by a large body of scientific evidence, and while some studies may have been influenced by industry, many independent studies have confirmed this relationship.
- The role of cholesterol in heart disease is well-established, with numerous studies showing that LDL cholesterol is a major risk factor for the development of cardiovascular disease.
- The benefits of replacing saturated fats with polyunsaturated fats, including some seed oils, in reducing heart disease risk have been supported by meta-analyses of randomized controlled trials.
- The interpretation of the data from the Minnesota Coronary Survey has been contested, and some experts argue that the study's design and methodology limit the conclusions that can be drawn from it.
- The claim of a historical cover-up is a serious accusation that requires substantial evidence, and while there have been instances of industry influence, the scientific community has mechanisms for self-correction and peer review to address such issues.
- The role of oxidized lipids in atherosclerosis is an area of active research, and while they may contribute to the disease process, the overall consensus is that multiple factors, including inflammation, lipoprotein levels, and lifestyle factors, play a role in atherosclerosis.
- The assertion that higher cholesterol in youth predicts future heart disease risk due to sluggish met ...
Actionables
- You can start a personal food diary to track your intake of seed oils and saturated fats, noting any changes in how you feel or your health markers. By keeping a detailed record of your meals, including the types of oils and fats consumed, you'll be able to observe patterns and correlations with your well-being. For example, if you notice that you feel more sluggish or have digestive issues after meals high in seed oils, you might consider reducing them in favor of traditional fats like butter or olive oil.
- Experiment with making your own salad dressings and condiments using traditional fats instead of store-bought options that often contain seed oils. This hands-on approach allows you to control the ingredients and avoid the potentially harmful oxidized fats. Start with simple recipes like olive oil and vinegar for salads or homemade mayonnaise using avocado oil, and gradually expand your repertoire to include a variety of flavors and fat source ...
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