#2283 - Billy Corgan

Billy Corgan and Joe Rogan discuss the complex relationship between artists and the music industry, emphasizing the struggle for creative control and authenticity.

Music Industry Stifles Artists' Vision

Billy Corgan scrutinizes the music industry for favoring marketable control over unique artistry, noting how it can suppress an artist's innate vision.

Industry Prioritizes Marketability Over Authenticity and Expression

Corgan explains that the industry does not understand why musicians cannot conform to a standard business model, like baking cookies, where product alterations meet customer demand. He expresses frustration with the industry, which sees an artist's authenticity as inconvenient to their profit-driven blueprint, treating an authentic persona as a problem that requires tempering.

Artists Told To "Temper" Styles for Commercial Success

Addressing industry pressures, Corgan recounts being asked to modify his music and public image to align with commercial aspirations. Conversation with Rogan indicates that bands like Aerosmith and Van Halen may have altered their original styles under similar pressures.

Industry Views Artist's Authentic Persona as "Inconvenient Problem" to Their Model

Corgan shares that his true self is considered a hindrance to the industry's business mode. Corgan and Rogan note alterations made by artists such as Aerosmith, possibly due to industry expectations for constant reinvention aimed at commercial viability.

Artists Navigate the Gap Between Creativity and Industry Interests

Despite industry constraints, artists continuously strive to assert their creative vision without sacrificing authenticity.

Musicians Intuitively Understand Art Differently Than the Industry

Corgan posits that the industry fails to grasp art as musicians do. There's a fundamental discrepancy in perception; the industry sees art as a commodity, whereas mus ...

Musicians often tap into deep, subconscious layers of expression, and their neurological makeup can be distinct from those in other professions. Billy Corgan, of The Smashing Pumpkins, sheds light on these aspects of a musician's life, from creative processes to brain chemistry.

Musicians' Creative Process Involves Subconscious Expression Layers

Billy Corgan shares that musicians often unconsciously integrate ideas and messages into their work. He recalls how, when high, he was able to hear his songs as if someone else were singing them and detected messages he hadn't realized he was including. This subconscious ability to embed messages became a conscious tool for Corgan once he noticed it, allowing him to deliberately plant certain themes in his music.

Corgan discovered that songs he thought were about superficial topics often had deeper, subconscious roots, such as abandonment issues related to his mother, which became apparent only after experiencing his music in an altered state. This unintentional depth resonated more with listeners than the meanings he initially assigned to his songs.

He also discusses how artists have a natural, untaught ability to emotionally engage listeners through beats, chords, melodies, and lyrics, suggesting a subconscious layer to their creative process. Rogan relates this to how music can guide psychedelic experiences, illustrating the intrinsic connection between music and deeper states of consciousness.

Neurology and Psychology of Musicians Differ From Others

Musicians' Bipolarity and Brain Chemistry Boost Artistic Ability

Musicians, Corgan posits, frequently exhibit bipolarity, which can enhance their creative output. He speculates that musicians become successful partly because they have developed one hemisphere of their brain more substantially, resulting in a unique imbalance that can contribute to their artistry. Drugs like cocaine are sometimes used by musicians with bipolarity to alleviate feelings of imbalance and achieve a sense of normalcy.

Corgan shares anecdotes of bipolar musicians who have felt that cocaine helps their brain hemispheres communicate more effectively. He theorizes that successful musicians might represent the "graduating class of bipolarity," acknowledging that their brain differences contribute to their artistic capabilities and the consistent "bad behavior" observed among musicians.

Skills and Training in Singing and Playing Instruments

Corgan delves into the specialized skills and physical training required by m ...

Billy Corgan, Joe Rogan, and others look at the remarkable influence certain bands and musicians have had on the music industry and how they continue to inspire generations.

Kurt Cobain and Nirvana's Impact on Music Landscape

Kurt Cobain left an indelible mark on music, embodying the spirit and struggles of Generation X.

Cobain's Vocals and Songwriting Embodied His Generation's Disaffection

Billy Corgan comments on the quality of Cobain's voice, noting that when Cobain sang, it sounded like the collective howl of their generation, connecting deeply with the experiences of latchkey kids. Cobain's singing conveyed a unique blend of anger and sorrow that resonated with the disaffected youth.

Nirvana's Success Paved the Way for Alternative and Grunge Acts to Achieve Mainstream Success

Corgan discusses the impact of Nirvana's "Nevermind" album, describing its release as a pivotal moment when alternative and grunge music broke through to the mainstream, facilitating the rise of many bands from their generation.

Monkees as a Template for Later Corporate-Manufactured Bands

The Monkees are acknowledged as pioneers in the emergence of manufactured music acts, predicting the contemporary music industry's trajectory.

Monkees: First Major Band Created by Corporation, Not Organically

Joe Rogan and Billy Corgan discuss the Monkees as one of the first major bands created by a corporation rather than forming organically. Corgan suggests that the Monkees are more relevant today, serving as a model for the music industry's evolution toward "plastic music."

Monkees' Success Predicted Rise of Manufactured Music Acts

Corgan implies that the success of the Monkees foreshadowed the rise of manufactured music acts, with authenticity becoming less critical in an industry where the idea of a corporately constructed band is no longer surprising.

Musicians Who Redefined Their Instruments: Hendrix & Van Halen

Jimi Hendrix and Eddie Van Halen are celebrated as virtuosos who transformed the way the guitar is played and set new benchmarks for technical expertise.

Virtuosic Guitarists' Technical Mastery Stunned and Inspired Musicians

Corgan mentions interviewing Steve Vai and expresses awe at the technical abilities of guitarists like Vai, Van Halen, and Hendrix. He sh ...

Billy Corgan shares insights into the tension between authenticity and commercialism in the art world, drawing on his personal experiences to describe how artists operate within this complex space, and Joe Rogan contributes to the discourse on how non-creatives influence art.

Authentic Artistic Voices Often Clash With Commercial Interests

In the pursuit of celebrating valuable and authentic contributors to American culture, Billy Corgan discusses his plan to start a podcast, noting the current focus on influencers rather than genuine artistry. He shares the story of his father, a musician with unfulfilled ambitions, illustrating the conflict between personal aspirations and external pressures. Corgan recounts the necessity of signing contracts with the mob in Chicago's music scene, showcasing an extreme case where commercial interests stifled artist independence and integrity.

Corgan, contrasting with artists who have built a mythical status within subcultures, admires the sustained impact of Mick Jagger and Keith Richards' genuine accomplishments. Despite music industry professionals advising him to prioritize audience demand, Corgan chose to maintain authenticity, informed by witnessing his father's own struggle in the industry. Although the commercial success often defines an artist's value, Corgan finds significance in his unique voice.

Visionary Artists Defying Industry Pressure Have Enduring Impact

Corgan criticizes the music industry’s approach, which fails to support successful artists in continued innovation. He remarks on the struggle for authenticity, noting Bruce Springsteen's candidness about his public persona versus his true self.

Corgan sees the resurgence of his band, The Smashing Pumpkins, as a testament to their authentic identity in an increasingly inauthentic world. As someone who has doubled down on what he represents despite industry pressure, Corgan has noted improvements in his business. He suggests that emerging changes in the music business might enable more direct peer-to-peer commerce, empowering visionary artists to have a more enduring impact without succumbing to industry norms.

Artists' Struggles Shape Creative Expression

Discussing non-creatives in show business, Joe Rogan and Corgan express dissatisfaction with the money-driven influence on the creative process. Corgan highlights the difficulty of navigating an identity between public expectation and personal evolution, exemplified by his band's trials and enduring identity, which underscore the impact of staying authentic despite external pressures.

Corgan's complicated relationship with his father, involving substance abuse, violence, and illegal activities, provided a tumultuous background that likely shap ...