Podcasts > Shawn Ryan Show > #134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

#134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

By Shawn Ryan Show

This episode delves into the history and modern landscape of foreign information warfare against the United States. John Gentry unpacks the systematic development of Soviet propaganda tactics during the 20th century and examines how Russia and China continue employing similar strategies today through targeted influence campaigns.

The discussion also explores allegations of politicization within the U.S. intelligence community during recent administrations. Gentry questions the purported impacts of diversity, equity, and inclusion initiatives on the intelligence community's effectiveness in fulfilling its national security mission, citing concerns over budgetary issues, hiring challenges, and performance problems. His forthcoming research aims to document these impacts further.

#134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

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#134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

1-Page Summary

The Systematic Development of Soviet Propaganda

John Gentry explains the Soviet Union developed propaganda tactics systematically in the early 20th century. Lenin and Stalin segmented people into categories like "party people" and "naive dupes" to inform influence strategies. The Comintern coordinated global communist propaganda until the KGB's "active measures" took over, involving tactics like forged documents and planted stories in foreign media.

Gentry highlights how the Soviets targeted liberals and universities, seeing opportunities to shape future leaders' worldviews from a young age. According to Gentry, the legacy of Soviet propaganda remains engrained in activist cultures on many college campuses to this day.

Contemporary Foreign Influence Campaigns

Gentry asserts that Russia continues employing similar propaganda techniques, though now targeting U.S. conservatives to undermine Ukraine support. China takes a different approach, utilizing its business ties and student population abroad to gather information and shape narratives favorably.

He also notes examples of former intelligence officials exploiting their credibility to mislead, such as suggesting Russian involvement in the Hunter Biden laptop story when evidence pointed elsewhere.

The Politicization of U.S. Intelligence

Under the Obama administration, Gentry states that diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) policies transformed federal workforces like the intelligence community. This allegedly promoted individuals aligned with the administration's agenda while marginalizing others.

The Trump administration failed to reverse these changes. Gentry cites examples of politically-motivated actions, like intelligence analysts withholding information from the White House due to policy disagreements.

He critiques the alliance between former intelligence officials, media, and political figures in opposing Trump, arguing this "temporary union" exploited intelligence for partisan gain.

Questioning the Impacts of DEI on Intelligence

Gentry discusses research suggesting DEI policies hampered the intelligence community's operational effectiveness, contrary to leadership claims. He cites budgetary issues, hiring challenges, identity-based divides, and performance problems as evidence of DEI's purported negative impacts.

His forthcoming research aims to document these impacts, asserting the need to reevaluate DEI's influence on the IC's ability to fulfill its national security mission effectively.

1-Page Summary

Additional Materials

Counterarguments

  • The effectiveness of Soviet propaganda tactics can be debated, as the influence on global politics and individual beliefs is complex and multifaceted.
  • The categorization of people into "party people" and "naive dupes" may oversimplify the diverse range of political beliefs and motivations that individuals hold.
  • The legacy of Soviet propaganda in activist cultures on college campuses could be seen as a reductionist view that doesn't account for the variety of influences on modern activism.
  • The assertion that Russia targets U.S. conservatives to undermine Ukraine support could be challenged by highlighting other groups and tactics Russia may use.
  • The role of China in using business ties and students abroad could be critiqued for potentially overstating the influence or effectiveness of these methods.
  • The claim that former intelligence officials mislead the public could be countered by emphasizing the need for critical analysis of all intelligence, regardless of its source.
  • The impact of DEI policies on federal workforces might be viewed differently, with some arguing that these policies enhance the effectiveness and fairness of the intelligence community.
  • The idea that the Trump administration did not reverse DEI changes could be seen as an oversimplification of the policies and actions taken during that time.
  • The withholding of information from the White House by intelligence analysts could be defended as a form of whistleblowing or ethical resistance.
  • The notion of a "temporary union" against Trump could be interpreted as a legitimate form of political opposition rather than exploitation of intelligence.
  • Research on the negative impacts of DEI could be critiqued for potential bias or methodological flaws, and alternative research might show positive impacts.
  • The claim that DEI leads to budgetary issues, hiring challenges, identity-based divides, and performance problems could be countered with evidence of DEI's benefits in organizational performance and morale.
  • The need to reevaluate DEI's influence on the intelligence community might be met with arguments that such evaluations should be balanced and include the positive aspects of DEI policies.

Actionables

  • You can enhance your critical thinking by analyzing different sources of information for potential biases and propaganda techniques. Start by consuming news from a variety of outlets with differing perspectives and take notes on the language used, the framing of issues, and the types of stories that are prioritized. Compare these notes to identify patterns that may indicate a particular bias or influence strategy.
  • Develop a personal policy for evaluating the credibility of former officials and experts who comment on current events. Create a checklist that includes their past positions, potential conflicts of interest, and historical accuracy of their statements. Use this checklist when you encounter commentary to assess the reliability of the information provided.
  • Encourage open discussions with peers about the impact of policies like DEI on organizational effectiveness without taking a political stance. Organize a book club or discussion group focused on reading and dissecting research papers or books on organizational psychology, effectiveness, and policy impacts. This can help you and your peers understand the complexities and real-world implications of such policies.

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#134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

The history and evolution of Russian/Soviet propaganda and information warfare tactics

The podcast anchored by John Gentry delves into the extensive history of Soviet propaganda and influence operations, emphasizing its systematic approach and long-term impact, especially in educational institutions.

The Soviet Union systematically developed propaganda and disinformation tactics in the early 20th century, creating "innocence clubs" and using front organizations to covertly spread their messaging.

John Gentry outlines the strategic foundation of Soviet propaganda initiated in the early 20th century. He notes how Lenin and Stalin categorized individuals to structure propaganda and recruitment efforts effectively. The term "party people" was used for those working directly for the Soviet government or affiliated communist parties. "Fellow travelers" referred to sympathizers not fully committed to the party, while "naive dupes" described those unknowingly serving the objectives of more informed communists.

The Soviets established the Comintern (Communist International) to coordinate global communist propaganda, which disbanded in 1943 due to Allied pressures but passed its mission of subversion to Soviet intelligence. Subsequently, the KGB took on the mantle of spreading disinformation with "active measures," such as forged documents and planted stories in foreign media, illustrating their pervasive and deceptive tactics.

The Soviets established the Comintern (Communist International) to coordinate global communist propaganda efforts, which were later taken over by the KGB after the Comintern was disbanded.

Willy Munsenberg was a key figure who organized printing presses and publishing houses to produce material that served Soviet interests. He also established "innocence clubs" disguised as homogenous groups to covertly recruit and manipulate people into promoting Soviet-aligned narratives.

The KGB developed sophisticated "active measures" involving forged documents, planted stories in foreign media, and leveraging sympathetic journalists to amplify their desired narratives.

The KGB further developed information warfare after the Com ...

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The history and evolution of Russian/Soviet propaganda and information warfare tactics

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Counterarguments

  • The effectiveness of Soviet propaganda and whether it truly infiltrated educational institutions to the extent described could be overstated; there may have been other factors at play that influenced activist culture in universities.
  • The categorization of individuals into "party people," "fellow travelers," and "naive dupes" might oversimplify the complex ways in which people interacted with and were influenced by Soviet propaganda.
  • The claim that political liberals were specifically targeted and seen as more gullible could be challenged by noting that propaganda often targets a wide spectrum of political beliefs and that susceptibility to propaganda is not necessarily linked to a particular political ideology.
  • The role of Willy Munsenberg and the effectiveness of "innocence clubs" could be re-evaluated in the context of the broader historical and social forces at the time, which might have influenced their success or failure.
  • The assertion that the KGB's "active measures" were always sophisticated and successful could be countered by highlighting instances where such measures were exposed or failed to achieve their intended imp ...

Actionables

  • You can sharpen your media literacy by analyzing news sources for potential biases and tracing the origins of sensational stories. Start by picking an article that makes a bold claim and research its sources, looking for the original data or statement. If the trail leads to dubious origins or the story is only reported by outlets with a known bias, it may be influenced by modern propaganda techniques.
  • Develop critical thinking skills by engaging in discussions that challenge your viewpoints. Find a debate club or online forum where people with diverse opinions gather and participate in discussions. Practice listening to understand, asking probing questions, and researching facts before forming an opinion, which can help you recognize manipulation tactics in arguments.
  • Encourage me ...

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#134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

The application of these tactics to manipulate U.S. audiences and institutions, particularly the intelligence community and media

Gentry elaborates on the contemporary challenges posed by foreign influence operations targeting the United States, highlighting that such activities are not solely for sowing discord but can also undermine support for key US foreign policy positions, such as that on Ukraine.

Different Goals, Diverse Tactics

According to Gentry, countries like Russia and China have adopted sophisticated strategies to manipulate narratives and influence policies in the United States.

The Russians have continued to employ similar information warfare tactics, though with different goals than the Soviets, aiming to divide the U.S. and undermine support for Ukraine.

Russian information operations have taken on a more specified target, aiming to weaken support for NATO and Ukraine and generate divisions within the EU. Gentry asserts that the Russians are targeting conservative audiences in the U.S., in contrast to the previous Soviet focus on liberals.

China has also developed extensive influence operations, utilizing business relationships and its large student population abroad to gather information and shape global narratives.

China's approach to influence differs from the Soviet model; rather than aiming to destroy, China molds the system to serve its interests. This is exemplified by their employment of Chinese students overseas as information gatherers for the Chinese Communist Party. Furthermore, China seeks to reshape international organizations to align with its views.

Iran and North Korea have also been active in conducting cyber-enabled information operations against the U.S.

While not mentioned in detail in the content provided, it is implicit that Iran and North Korea play a role in this new era of information warfare against the United States.

Manipulation and Influence in the Intelligence Community and Media

Gentry discusses how the misuse of intelligence prestige can mislead the public, as seen in the handling of Hunter Biden's laptop incident, where former intelligence officials suggested Russian involvement where it seemed unlikely.

The Russians have targeted conservative and Republican-leaning audiences in the U.S. in recent years, in contrast to the Soviet focus on liberals, in an effort to sow discord and weaken support for NATO and Ukraine.

John Gentry posits that Russia's contemporary information warfare tactics strive to create internal conflicts within the United States, specifically targeting conservatives to disrupt the unity over U.S. foreign policy regarding Ukraine.

China has also developed extensive influence operations, uti ...

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The application of these tactics to manipulate U.S. audiences and institutions, particularly the intelligence community and media

Additional Materials

Counterarguments

  • While Russia and China are highlighted for their influence operations, it's important to recognize that many countries, including the U.S., engage in similar activities as part of their foreign policy and intelligence strategies.
  • The focus on conservative audiences by Russian operations could be seen as an oversimplification, as influence campaigns may target any group perceived as influential or vulnerable, regardless of political orientation.
  • The use of Chinese students and business relationships for influence operations could be considered a narrow view of the broader soft power strategies employed by many nations, which often include cultural exchanges and educational programs.
  • The mention of Iran and North Korea's cyber operations without detail may oversimplify the complex nature of cyber threats and the variety of actors involved, including non-state actors.
  • The Hunter Biden laptop incident's handling by intelligence officials could be viewed within a broader context of the challenges intelligence communities face in distinguishing between misinformation and legitimate intelligence, especially in a highly politicized environment.
  • The assertion that Russia specifically targets conservative and Republican-leaning audiences in the U.S. may not account for the possibility that their operations are opportunistic and non-partisan, aiming to exploit any divisive issue.
  • The implication that China's influence operations are primarily malign could be balanced with an acknowled ...

Actionables

  • You can enhance your media literacy by regularly checking the sources of news articles you read, especially those that evoke strong emotions, to ensure they come from reputable outlets. By doing this, you'll become more adept at recognizing potential misinformation and less likely to be swayed by narratives that may be part of foreign influence operations. For example, if an article claims that a major event has occurred but you can't find any coverage from established news sources, it might be a red flag.
  • Develop a habit of cross-referencing news stories with foreign policy experts on social media to gain diverse perspectives. Follow a variety of experts from different political and cultural backgrounds to balance the narratives you're exposed to. When you read a story about international relations or foreign policy, look up what these experts are saying to see if there's a consensus or if the story might be skewed by a particular agenda.
  • Encourage open disc ...

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#134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

The politicization of the intelligence community and the alliance between former officials, the media, and political actors

The recent collaboration between the intelligence community, media, and political actors raises concerns about the politicization of agencies meant to remain nonpartisan. John Gentry and others discuss the origins and potential consequences of this trend.

During the Obama administration, diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) policies were aggressively implemented in the intelligence community, altering its organizational culture and demographics.

The Obama administration sought to "transform" the federal workforce, including the intelligence agencies, by mandating DEI hiring, promotion, and assignment practices.

John Gentry notes that during the Obama administration, the federal workforce, including intelligence agencies underwent significant changes emphasizing DEI policies. These changes aimed to hire, promote, and assign employees based on demographic groups, potentially leading to the promotion of those aligned with the administration’s agenda and the marginalization of others.

Gentry indicates that President Obama's executive order in August 2011 pushed these practices with the intention of transforming not just the workforce but the country. The Director of National Intelligence, who was granted coordinating power by the 2004 Reform Act, implemented DEI strategies within the Office of the Director of National Intelligence and the CIA.

This led to the promotion of individuals aligned with the administration's political agenda and the marginalization of those perceived as unsupportive.

Gentry asserts that this emphasis on identity over individual merit aligns with what he describes as cultural Marxism and has shifted away from traditional operations within the federal government and intelligence community.

The Trump administration largely failed to address or reverse these changes, allowing the politicization of the intelligence community to continue and escalate.

Despite warnings from knowledgeable people in the intelligence community about political activism, Gentry notes that Trump's advisors and senior appointees, including acting DNI Dan Coats and Sue Gordon from CIA, did not take significant administrative action to reverse the previous administration's policies.

Gentry expresses concerns about the problematic actions arising from the changing organizational culture within the agencies, where individuals feel compelled to act against what they perceive as "evil," especially during the Trump years. This has exacerbated the politicization and led to a sentiment in which certain individuals perceived Trump as wrong or evil.

Gentrystates that these internal changes have compromised the integrity of intelligence work, leading to instances where intelligence products were allegedly tailored for political reasons. He references a letter by the analytical ombudsman of the ODNI to the Senate Intelligence Committee, which describes the withholding of information from the White House by China analysts due to disagreement with Trump's policies, and Russia analysts from the CIA pushing a narrative about Trump being manipulated by Putin.

Moreover, Gentry and Shawn Ryan discuss leak ...

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The politicization of the intelligence community and the alliance between former officials, the media, and political actors

Additional Materials

Counterarguments

  • DEI policies are designed to correct systemic biases and create a more representative and fair workplace, which can enhance the quality of decision-making by bringing diverse perspectives.
  • Transforming the federal workforce to be more inclusive does not necessarily lead to politicization but can be seen as an effort to modernize and improve the effectiveness of government agencies.
  • The emphasis on DEI does not inherently align with cultural Marxism, as it can also be framed as an extension of democratic principles and equal opportunity.
  • The failure of the Trump administration to reverse certain policies may not be due to negligence but could be interpreted as an acknowledgment that some of these policies may have merit or that abrupt reversals could be disruptive.
  • Allegations of intelligence products being tailored for political reasons require thorough investigation to substantiate, and it is possible that such instances are exceptions rather than indicative of widespread practice.
  • Leaks and disinformation can occur for various reasons, and not all leaks are politically motivated; some may be motivated by concerns over legality, ethics, or public interest.
  • The involvement of former intelligence officials in media discussions can provide valuable insights based on experience, and not all such engagements are necessarily politically motiv ...

Actionables

  • You can enhance your critical thinking by analyzing different news sources for bias and comparing their coverage of intelligence community-related events. Start by selecting a recent intelligence-related news story and read about it from multiple sources across the political spectrum. Note the differences in language, focus, and any potential bias or political slant. This exercise will help you develop a more nuanced understanding of how information can be presented and politicized.
  • Develop a habit of fact-checking statements related to intelligence affairs made by politicians and media personalities. Use non-partisan fact-checking websites to verify claims and understand the context behind them. This practice will help you become more skeptical of the information you receive and better equipped to discern truth from political narrative.
  • Encourage open discu ...

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#134 John Gentry - Unpacking the Information War Against the U.S.

The impact of diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) policies on the effectiveness of the intelligence community

There is a contentious debate regarding the impact that diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) policies have had on the operational performance of the intelligence community (IC).

There is growing evidence that the DEI policies implemented in the intelligence community have had a detrimental impact on its operational performance and effectiveness.

John Gentry critically discusses DEI policies, suggesting that they are enforced by diversity offices within intelligence agencies and can sometimes lead to the termination of managers who do not adhere to these standards. He claims that there is a significant number of IC members who support DEI on political or ideological grounds or due to material interests, which could affect the IC's operational performance.

The intelligence community leadership has claimed that DEI policies improve operational performance, but independent analysis has found no evidence to support this claim.

Leaders such as Jim Clapper and John Brennan have claimed that DEI policies improve operations within the IC, but Gentry, drawing on his academic research, has published a paper refuting those assertions. He asserts there is no evidence supporting the claim that DEI improves performance and anticipates that forthcoming publications will argue that DEI is substantially damaging to operational performance.

In contrast, there is substantial anecdotal evidence that the DEI policies have created budgetary issues, hiring challenges, and performance problems in the field.

Gentry argues that DEI policies divide the workforce and create internal conflict by establishing employee resource groups focused on demographic identities. He states that these policies have raised accusations of preferential hiring that led to demographic imbalances and operational problems, citing the experiences of individuals who reached out to him confirming his suspicions. Also, the ...

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The impact of diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) policies on the effectiveness of the intelligence community

Additional Materials

Counterarguments

  • DEI policies may enhance operational performance by bringing diverse perspectives that can lead to better decision-making and understanding of complex global issues.
  • Effective implementation of DEI policies can lead to a more inclusive work environment, which can improve morale and reduce turnover.
  • There may be evidence or studies that show DEI policies have a positive impact on organizational performance, which has not been acknowledged or included in the analysis.
  • The claim that DEI policies lead to the termination of managers may be overstated or lack context regarding the circumstances of such terminations.
  • Support for DEI on political or ideological grounds does not inherently imply a negative impact on operational performance.
  • Anecdotal evidence of negative impacts should be weighed against systematic data or research that might indicate broader trends or outcomes.
  • The creation of employee resource groups can provide support networks for underrepresented employees, which can enhance their contribution to the organization.
  • The expansion of favored g ...

Actionables

  • You can evaluate the impact of policies in your workplace by conducting anonymous surveys to gauge employee sentiment and operational efficiency. Create a simple questionnaire that asks colleagues how recent policy changes have affected their work satisfaction, collaboration, and productivity. This can help identify if similar issues are present in your organization and provide a platform for constructive feedback.
  • Start a personal journal to document your observations on policy changes and their effects on your work environment. Note any changes in team dynamics, project outcomes, or personal job satisfaction that occur after new policies are implemented. This can serve as a private case study, giving you insights into the real-world implications of policy shifts on a smaller scale.
  • Engage in conversation ...

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