Podcasts > Science Vs > Ayahuasca: WTF is up with DMT?

Ayahuasca: WTF is up with DMT?

By Spotify Studios

"Science Vs" plunges into the enigmatic world of DMT, a psychedelic that intrigues with its warp-speed onset and profound experiences. Alongside host Wendy Zukerman, specialists like David Olson explore DMT’s brief yet intense journey—characterized by immersive hallucinations and encounters that defy ordinary reality. Listener Anya shares her firsthand account, delving into the alien-like visions provoked by this short-acting substance, while the team illuminates why DMT's rapid peak sets it apart from its long-lasting psychedelic counterparts.

The episode doesn't just marvel at DMT's powerful effects; it investigates its burgeoning role in mental health treatment, where its potential to induce rapid neuroplasticity could revolutionize our approach to depression, anxiety, and addiction. Joel Werner discusses small-scale clinical trials forecasting a brighter future for mental health therapies, underscored by accounts of lasting benefits from patients with treatment-resistant conditions. Yet, in an objective assessment of DMT's potential, the episode also presents the psychological risks involved, acknowledging the gravity of adverse experiences while reassuring the rarity of severe repercussions—painting a comprehensive picture of DMT’s science and safety.

Ayahuasca: WTF is up with DMT?

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Ayahuasca: WTF is up with DMT?

1-Page Summary

Key Topics and Effects of DMT

DMT (Dimethyltryptamine) is a potent psychedelic substance known for its rapid and intense effects which include vivid hallucinations and a distorted sense of reality. Users like Anya report sensations of acceleration and strong visual hallucinations that are highly immersive, with experiences such as feeling like being in a space with alien entities. The intensity of DMT trips is usually high, but they are short-acting, typically peaking at two to three minutes and concluding within about 15 minutes, which sets DMT apart from other longer-lasting psychedelics.

Potential as Medicine

DMT is gaining attention for its potential rapid antidepressant and anxiolytic effects, with small clinical trials and surveys promising it as a treatment for depression, anxiety, and addiction. Joel Werner and researchers have noted how psychedelics like DMT can prompt neuroplasticity and dendritic growth at a much faster rate than traditional antidepressants, with effects lasting for weeks. In clinical trials, some participants showed remission from moderate to severe depression six months after treatment, and in a Yale study, individuals with treatment-resistant depression had significantly decreased depressive symptoms after DMT administration. The brew ayahuasca, which contains DMT, has also demonstrated impressive results in treating depression and addiction, suggesting that physical changes in brain cells from DMT usage might contribute to therapeutic effects independent of its psychedelic experience.

Risks and Safety

While DMT has potential therapeutic benefits, its safety concerns are largely psychological. It can lead to intense anxiety and fear, and in rare cases, induce psychosis. However, the likelihood of severe adverse reactions such as death is exceptionally low. Despite the primary risks being psychological, incidents of individuals having anxiety-inducing experiences during trials are noted, highlighting that DMT's potential risks, though rare, are serious considerations. Compared to other psychedelics, DMT appears to have lower risks of severe psychological reactions.

1-Page Summary

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • Neuroplasticity is the brain's ability to reorganize itself by forming new neural connections throughout life. Dendritic growth specifically involves the development of dendrites, which are branch-like extensions of neurons that receive signals from other neurons. This process is crucial for learning, memory, and adapting to new experiences. Psychedelics like DMT have been suggested to promote neuroplasticity and dendritic growth at an accelerated rate, potentially contributing to therapeutic effects on mental health conditions.
  • Ayahuasca is a traditional plant medicine used in spiritual ceremonies in the Amazon region. It is a brew typically made from the Banisteriopsis caapi vine and the leaves of the Psychotria viridis shrub, which contains DMT. The combination of these plants creates a potent psychedelic experience that can lead to profound introspection and spiritual insights. Ayahuasca ceremonies are often guided by experienced shamans and are believed to have therapeutic effects on mental health conditions such as depression, anxiety, and addiction.
  • Treatment-resistant depression (TRD) is a term used for individuals with major depressive disorder who do not respond well to standard antidepressant treatments within a reasonable timeframe. Factors contributing to TRD can include inadequate dosage, patient noncompliance, misdiagnosis, and comorbid psychiatric disorders. In TRD cases, additional treatments like psychotherapy, lithium, or aripiprazole may be considered. Comorbid psychiatric disorders, especially anxiety disorders, are common in individuals with treatment-resistant depression and can complicate diagnosis and treatment.
  • DMT, a potent psychedelic substance, can lead to intense anxiety, fear, and in rare cases, induce psychosis. Severe adverse reactions from DMT are exceptionally low, with the primary safety concerns being psychological rather than physical. While incidents of anxiety-inducing experiences during trials have been noted, the likelihood of severe adverse reactions like death is very rare. Compared to other psychedelics, DMT generally has lower risks of severe psychological reactions.
  • The psychological risks of DMT primarily involve inducing intense anxiety, fear, and in rare cases, psychosis. While severe adverse reactions like death are exceptionally rare, the potential for serious psychological effects, such as anxiety-inducing experiences, is a notable concern. Compared to other psychedelics, DMT generally presents lower risks of severe psychological reactions.

Counterarguments

  • The therapeutic potential of DMT is still under investigation, and larger, more comprehensive clinical trials are needed to establish its efficacy and safety.
  • The long-term psychological effects of DMT are not well understood, and there may be risks that have not yet been identified.
  • The rapid effects of DMT could be disorienting or traumatic for some individuals, potentially leading to negative experiences that outweigh the benefits.
  • The current body of research may not adequately represent the diversity of the population, including different age groups, ethnic backgrounds, and pre-existing mental health conditions.
  • Dependence on DMT for therapeutic effects could potentially lead to psychological dependency or abuse, despite its low potential for addiction.
  • The positive effects observed in clinical trials may be influenced by the controlled setting and the presence of medical professionals, which may not translate to unsupervised use.
  • The notion that DMT's therapeutic effects are independent of its psychedelic experience is speculative and requires further research to understand the relationship between the subjective experience and clinical outcomes.
  • The comparison of DMT's safety profile to other psychedelics may not account for the full spectrum of risks associated with its use, especially in unsupervised or recreational settings.
  • The potential for DMT to induce psychosis, even if rare, is a significant concern that warrants caution and further study before widespread therapeutic use is considered.
  • The legal status of DMT as a controlled substance in many jurisdictions may impact the accessibility and regulation of its use for therapeutic purposes, potentially limiting the scope of research and application.

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Ayahuasca: WTF is up with DMT?

Key Topics and Effects of DMT

DMT, or Dimethyltryptamine, is a powerful psychedelic substance known for its rapid and intense effects. Individuals like Anya report profound experiences under its influence.

Psychedelic properties, mechanism of action, subjective experiences

Causes vivid, immersive hallucinations, disrupts networks in the brain responsible for perceiving reality

During her DMT trip, Anya experiences a cold flush immediately followed by a tingling or rushing sensation and a feeling of acceleration, signaling the onset of the drug's effects. She reports strong visual hallucinations, which include not just geometrical patterns but also the sensation of being examined by entities using tendrils to explore every single cell of her body.

Anya recounts a trip that felt like being in an intergalactic hub with various alien entities, which she describes as being akin to something out of a "Rick and Morty" episode. After the experience, she reflects on the bizarre nature of the space pirates her mind created during the trip, ...

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Key Topics and Effects of DMT

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • Anya's DMT trip involved experiencing intense visual hallucinations and feeling like she was in an intergalactic hub with alien entities. She described the entities examining her body with tendrils and creating a space pirate scenario in her mind. The trip was short-acting, lasting about 30 to 45 minutes, with the peak occurring within two to three minutes of ingestion. The intensity of the experience was high, but the duration was relatively brief compared to other psychedelics.
  • The brain networks responsible for perceiving reality are interconnected regions that process sensory information and construct our conscious experience of the world. These networks integrate sensory inputs like vision, touch, and sound to create a coherent perception of our surroundings. Disruption to these networks, as seen with DMT, can lead to altered perceptions and vivid hallucinations, influencing how we interpret and interact with reality.
  • DMT is known for its intense effects, with users often reporting profound and immersive experiences in a short period. Compared to other psychedelics like LSD or psilocybin, DMT's effects are typically more intense but shorter in duration, lasting around 30 to 45 minutes in total, with the peak occurri ...

Counterarguments

  • DMT's effects on the brain's networks are complex and not fully understood; while it disrupts certain networks, it may also enhance or alter others in ways that are not yet clear.
  • The sensation of a cold flush, tingling, and acceleration may not be universal and can vary greatly between individuals.
  • Not all individuals experience strong visual hallucinations or encounters with entities; some may have more emotional or introspective experiences.
  • The interpretation of hallucinations as being in an intergalactic hub or seeing alien entities is subjective and influenced by personal and cultural contexts.
  • The creation of bizarre entities like space pirates is a personal experience and may not resonate with the experiences of other DMT users.
  • While DMT is known for its short duration, the lasting psychological impact of the experience can extend well beyond the acute effects of the ...

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Ayahuasca: WTF is up with DMT?

Potential as Medicine

Rapid antidepressant, anxiolytic effects reported; Increases in plasticity and neural connections observed

Results from some small clinical trials and surveys show promise for treating depression, anxiety, and addiction

Joel Werner highlights a growing interest in the therapeutic potentials of DMT, enhanced by reports of life-changing experiences from those who have taken the drug.

Researchers like Olson have discovered that psychedelics, including DMT, encourage neuroplasticity through the growth of new dendrites on neurons. This is a remarkable similarity to the way traditional antidepressants operate, but with a significant difference: psychedelics can induce growth within 24 hours and maintain effects for weeks, unlike SSRIs which may take weeks or months to show benefits.

Werner discusses an ongoing clinical trial where 34 participants with moderate to severe depression were involved, some of whom had to cease their antidepressant medications prior to starting the trial. Follow-ups six months after the trial indicated that 10 of the participants were in remission. Further details suggest that this research potentially indicates DMT's effectiveness as a treatment for depression, as evidenced in both small-scale clinical trials and numerous surveys.

A Yale study specifically involving seven people with treatment-resistant depression found that their depression scores decreased significantly the day after they were administered DMT. Similarly, ayahuasca, a brew that contains DMT, showed promising results for treating depression, anxi ...

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Potential as Medicine

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • Neuroplasticity is the brain's ability to reorganize itself by forming new neural connections throughout life. Dendrites are branch-like extensions of neurons that receive signals from other neurons. They play a crucial role in transmitting information within the brain by receiving signals from axons of other neurons. This process of communication between neurons through dendrites is essential for various brain functions, including learning, memory, and mood regulation. Stimulating dendritic growth through factors like psychedelics can enhance neuroplasticity, potentially leading to therapeutic effects on conditions like depression.
  • Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) are a class of antidepressant medications commonly prescribed to treat conditions like depression and anxiety disorders. They work by increasing the levels of serotonin, a neurotransmitter in the brain, which helps regulate mood. Unlike psychedelics such as DMT, which can induce rapid changes in brain function, SSRIs typically require weeks or even months to show their full therapeutic effects.
  • Treatment-resistant depression (TRD) is a term used for individuals with major depressive disorder who do not respond adequately to standard antidepressant treatments within a reasonable timeframe. Factors contributing to TRD can include inadequate dosage of medication, patient noncompliance, misdiagnosis, and comorbid psychiatric disorders. In TRD cases, additional treatments like psychotherapy, lithium, or aripiprazole may be considered, although their efficacy can vary. Comorbid psychiatric disorders, such as anxiety disorders, are often associated with treatment-resistant depression and can complicate the evaluation and management of the condition.
  • Ayahuasca is a psychoactive brew traditionally used in spiritual ceremonies and healing practices by Indigenous cultures in South America. It contains DMT from the Psychotria viridis shrub and harmala alkaloids from the Banisteriopsis caapi vine, which work together to induce psychedeli ...

Counterarguments

  • The sample sizes in the studies mentioned are small, which may not provide a robust enough data set to draw definitive conclusions about the efficacy of DMT.
  • The long-term effects and safety profile of DMT are not well understood, and more research is needed to ensure it is safe for use as a medicine.
  • The rapid effects of psychedelics might not address the underlying causes of mental health conditions, potentially leading to symptom relief without long-term healing.
  • The subjective nature of psychedelic experiences can vary greatly between individuals, making standardized treatment protocols challenging.
  • The remission of depression in participants could be influenced by placebo effects or other confounding factors not controlled for in the studies.
  • The reduction in depression scores after DMT administration may not be sustained over time, and repeated treatments could be necessary, raising concerns about the potential for abuse or psychological dependence.
  • The structural changes observed in rat brain cells may not directly translate to similar therapeutic effects in humans due to differences in physiology and complexity of human brains.
  • The legal status of DMT as a cont ...

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Ayahuasca: WTF is up with DMT?

Risks and Safety

Concerns about the safety of psychedelic substances like DMT are prevalent, but research indicates that the risks are primarily psychological rather than physical.

Main risks are psychological; Rare cases of death or psychosis, but DMT seems quite safe

While DMT is generally considered safe, it can induce psychologically challenging experiences. For instance, during a trial, one individual reported an intense anxiety-inducing experience when they felt consumed by an entity. Such incidents underscore that, though rare, there are potential risks associated with the use of DMT that should not be overlooked.

Can cause extreme anxiety, fear, confrontation for some; Risks seem lower than other psychedelics

...

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Risks and Safety

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • DMT, short for N,N-Dimethyltryptamine, is a powerful hallucinogenic compound found naturally in certain plants and animals. When consumed, DMT can induce intense visual and auditory hallucinations, altered perceptions of time and space, and profound spiritual experiences. It is often referred to as one of the most potent psychedelic substances known to humans.
  • The distinction between psychological and physical risks lies in the effects on the mind versus the body. Psychological risks involve impacts on mental well-being, such as anxiety or confronting experiences, while physical risks relate to direct harm to the body, like organ damage or overdose. In the context of DMT, the main risks are psychological, focusing on potential challenging mental experiences, rather than immediate physical harm. This distinction is crucial for understanding the specific types of dangers associated with using substances like DMT.
  • When comparing the risks of DMT to other psychedelics, it is suggested that DMT may have lower risks overall, with severe adverse reactions like death or psychosis ...

Counterarguments

  • The long-term psychological effects of DMT are not fully understood, and more research is needed to assess safety comprehensively.
  • Psychological risks can have profound impacts on an individual's life and should not be minimized when considering the overall safety of a substance.
  • The setting in which DMT is used can significantly influence the risk of adverse psychological reactions, and uncontrolled use may increase these risks.
  • Comparing the safety of different psychedelics can be challenging due to variations in usage patterns, dosages, and individual responses.
  • The rarity of severe adverse reactions does not negate the importance of considering the potential for harm in vulnerable individuals.
  • The legal status of DMT in many countries reflects concerns about its ...

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