Podcasts > REAL ONES with Jon Bernthal > Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

By Jon Bernthal

In the latest gripping episode of "REAL ONES with Jon Bernthal," host Jon Bernthal sits down with acclaimed actor and filmmaker Sean Penn to delve into the heart of Penn's latest documentary project set against the tumultuous backdrop of Ukraine. Audiences are offered a rare glimpse into Penn's vision and the influences shaping his filmmaking journey as he draws comparisons with the powerful narratives captured in "Restrepo," illuminating the civilian and political response in Ukraine amidst growing tension.

Penn's creative partnership with Billy Smith, the beginning stages of the documentary's creation, and its compelling shift of focus forms the core of their discussion. As the conversation unveils how geopolitical events, such as the Russian military's increasing presence in 2021 and rising global pandemic challenges, molded the direction and depth of the documentary, listeners are privy to an authentic portrayal of Ukraine's national resilience. The synergy between Bernthal and Penn transcends the barriers between entertainment and deep human experience, offering a profound perspective on a nation's defense of its heritage and identity in the face of adversity.

Listen to the original

Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

This is a preview of the Shortform summary of the Dec 14, 2023 episode of the REAL ONES with Jon Bernthal

Sign up for Shortform to access the whole episode summary along with additional materials like counterarguments and context.

Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

1-Page Summary

The Genesis of a Vision: Inception and Influences

The Intended Atmosphere: Insights from Jon Bernthal and Sean Penn

In a candid discussion, Sean Penn draws parallels between the atmosphere his documentary aims to capture and that portrayed in the documentary "Restrepo," focusing specifically on Ukraine's civilian and political response to mounting threats.

Restrepo’s Reflection: Spotlight on Ukraine's Civilian and Political Climate

Jon Bernthal probes for deeper insights into the evolution of Sean's project, a progression that tells a unique tale in light of the Ukrainian crisis.

The Filmmaking Journey: Creative Collaborations and Subject Exploration

The Partnership: Billy Smith's Multi-faceted Expertise

Sean Penn reveals his creative partnership with Billy Smith, a man of varied talents including acting, law enforcement, and military experience. This collaboration underpins the documentary's inception and Smith's diverse background offers a valuable perspective.

The Abandoned Syrian Project: Confronting Investigatory Restrictions

Initially, Sean embarked on a documentary seeking to understand why President Assad of Syria maintained power after the Arab Spring. However, the Syrian regime's stringent limitations on investigation led to the project's collapse, prompting a strategic withdrawal.

The Khashoggi Decision: Avoiding Documentary Duplication

Another potential subject, the assassination of Jamal Khashoggi, was set aside when Sean discovered a competing filmmaker already pursuing the topic. Sean and Billy chose not to duplicate efforts, respecting the story's need for thorough coverage.

Zooming into Ukraine: The Central Narrative Unfolds

President Zelensky's Unique Path: Comedian to National Leader

The documentary took a definitive turn when Sean became intrigued by President Zelensky of Ukraine, a former comedian whose political ascent mirrored a role he once played on television, suggesting a compelling story arc for the film.

Crafting Authenticity: Breaking Language Barriers with President Zelensky

Amidst the pandemic, Sean seized the opportunity to establish a rapport with Zelensky through video calls, setting out to portray the Ukrainian leader's character genuinely and without the hindrance of language differences.

Pandemic Roadblocks: Virtual Connections and Deferred Plans

Although the global health crisis temporarily stalled hands-on progress, it inadvertently deepened the documentary's narrative scope and preparation.

Political Tensions Rise: Russian Military Movements in 2021

As 2021 came to a head, escalating military posturing by Russia near the Ukrainian border forced an urgent pivot in the documentary's subject matter, pressing Sean's team to address increasingly serious themes.

Groundwork in a Nation under Threat: Cultural Immersion and Conflict Insight

Cultural Exploration: Engaging with Ukraine’s Heritage and People

Despite a missed in-person meeting with President Zelensky due to a complex intelligence operation, Sean’s team immersed themselves in the nuances of Ukrainian culture and the conflict at play.

The Spirit of Ukraine: Resilience in the Face of Invasion

Returning to Ukraine with the threat of invasion at its apex, Sean was struck by the stout heart of the country, encapsulated in the people's unified determination to resist Russian invasion, as well as by the national railway's slogan embodying both firmness and humanity—a testament to the enduring spirit of Ukraine.

1-Page Summary

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • Sean Penn's project aims to capture Ukraine's response to threats, focusing on civilian and political aspects. "Restrepo" portrays the atmosphere of conflict and challenges faced by soldiers in Afghanistan. Both documentaries delve into complex societal and political dynamics in regions experiencing turmoil and crisis.
  • Sean Penn initially started a documentary project to investigate why President Assad of Syria maintained power after the Arab Spring. However, due to the Syrian regime's strict restrictions on investigative activities, the project faced significant challenges and ultimately had to be abandoned. This led to a strategic decision to withdraw from the Syrian project and shift focus to other subjects.
  • Sean Penn and Billy Smith decided to abandon the documentary on Jamal Khashoggi due to the discovery of another filmmaker already working on the same topic. They chose to respect the need for comprehensive coverage of the story by avoiding duplication of efforts. This decision was made to ensure that the documentary they were working on would offer a unique perspective and not compete with existing projects.
  • President Zelensky's transition from a comedian to a national leader is significant because it represents a unique shift in career paths, showcasing his ability to connect with the public through humor and entertainment before entering the political arena. This journey highlights the unconventional nature of his rise to power, bringing attention to his background in the entertainment industry and how it influenced his approach to governance. Zelensky's experience as a comedian offers insights into his communication style, charisma, and ability to engage with diverse audiences, shaping his leadership style in a distinctive manner. His trajectory underscores the complexities of modern politics and the evolving perceptions of leadership in contemporary society.
  • The pandemic deepened the documentary's narrative scope by necessitating virtual connections and altering plans. It forced the team to adapt their approach, leading to a more comprehensive exploration of the subject matter. The limitations imposed by the pandemic prompted a reevaluation of how to convey the story effectively. Despite the challenges, the pandemic inadvertently enriched the documentary's content and preparation.
  • In 2021, there were escalating military tensions between Russia and Ukraine due to Russian military movements near the Ukrainian border. These movements raised concerns about potential conflict and prompted a shift in the documentary's focus to address the evolving geopolitical situation. The proximity of Russian forces to Ukraine heightened the urgency of the situation, influencing the narrative direction of the documentary. The developments underscored the volatile nature of the region and the impact of geopolitical dynamics on the filmmaking process.

Get access to the context and additional materials

So you can understand the full picture and form your own opinion.
Get access for free
Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

The Genesis of a Vision: Inception and Influences

The Intended Atmosphere: Insights from Jon Bernthal and Sean Penn

In a candid discussion, Sean Penn draws parallels between the atmosphere his documentary aims to capture and that portrayed in 'Restrepo', a documentary depicting soldiers' experiences in Afghanistan, focusing specifically on Ukraine's civilian and political response to mounting threats, seeking to achieve a similar sense of immediacy and intensity.

Restrepo’s Reflection: Spotlight ...

Here’s what you’ll find in our full summary

Registered users get access to the Full Podcast Summary and Additional Materials. It’s easy and free!
Start your free trial today

The Genesis of a Vision: Inception and Influences

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • 'Restrepo' is a documentary film that follows a platoon of U.S. soldiers deployed in Afghanistan's Korengal Valley. The film provides an intimate look at the soldiers' experiences and the challenges they face in a hostile environment. Directed by Sebastian Junger and Tim Hetherington, 'Restrepo' received critical acclaim for its raw portrayal of war ...

Counterarguments

  • While drawing parallels with 'Restrepo' can be insightful, it's important to consider that the context of the Ukrainian crisis may require a different approach to accurately capture the unique aspects of this conflict.
  • Achieving a sense of immediacy and intensity is a noble goal, but it's crucial to balance this with a respectful portrayal of the subjects, especially when dealing with sensitive topics like war and civilian suffering.
  • The focus on Ukraine's civilian and political response is significant, but it should not overshadow the broader geopolitical implications and the experiences of other affected groups.
  • Jon Bernthal's probing for deeper insights is valuable, but it's also important to ensure that th ...

Get access to the context and additional materials

So you can understand the full picture and form your own opinion.
Get access for free
Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

The Filmmaking Journey: Creative Collaborations and Subject Exploration

The Partnership: Billy Smith's Multi-faceted Expertise

Sean Penn reveals his creative partnership with Billy Smith, a man of varied talents including acting, law enforcement, and military experience.

This collaboration underpins the documentary's inception and Smith's diverse background offers a valuable perspective.

The Abandoned Syrian Project: Confronting Investigatory Restrictions

Initially, Sean embarked on a documentary seeking to understand why President Assad of Syria maintained power after the Arab Spring.

However, the Syrian regime's stringent limitations on investigation led to the project's collapse, prompting a strategic withdrawal.

The Khashogg ...

Here’s what you’ll find in our full summary

Registered users get access to the Full Podcast Summary and Additional Materials. It’s easy and free!
Start your free trial today

The Filmmaking Journey: Creative Collaborations and Subject Exploration

Additional Materials

Clarifications

...

Counterarguments

  • While Billy Smith's diverse background is highlighted as foundational, it could be argued that a more specialized expertise in filmmaking or the documentary's subject matter might have been more beneficial.
  • The decision to abandon the Syrian documentary project due to investigatory restrictions could be seen as a missed opportunity to find alternative, creative ways to tell the story within those limitations.
  • Strategic withdrawal from the Syrian project might be criticized for potentially leaving an important narrative unexplored, especially if other filmmakers are not addressing it.
  • The choice to not pursue the Khashoggi documentary because another filmmaker was already doing so could be questioned; multiple documentaries on the sa ...

Get access to the context and additional materials

So you can understand the full picture and form your own opinion.
Get access for free
Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

Zooming into Ukraine: The Central Narrative Unfolds

President Zelensky's Unique Path: Comedian to National Leader

The documentary took a definitive turn when Sean became intrigued by President Zelensky of Ukraine, a former comedian whose political ascent mirrored a role he once played on television, suggesting a compelling story arc for the film.

This interest was piqued during a problematic phone exchange between U.S. President Trump and Zelensky, marking a pivotal moment that influenced the direction of the documentary.

Crafting Authenticity: Breaking Language Barriers with Presiden ...

Here’s what you’ll find in our full summary

Registered users get access to the Full Podcast Summary and Additional Materials. It’s easy and free!
Start your free trial today

Zooming into Ukraine: The Central Narrative Unfolds

Additional Materials

Clarifications

...

Counterarguments

  • While Sean's interest in Zelensky's background is understandable, it could be argued that focusing on his past as a comedian might overshadow or simplify the complexity of the political and social challenges he faces as a leader.
  • The narrative of Zelensky's political ascent mirroring his television role could be seen as reductive, as it may not fully account for the various factors and circumstances that contributed to his rise to power.
  • The emphasis on the phone exchange with President Trump as a pivotal moment might be challenged on the grounds that it potentially overstates the impact of a single event on the broader context of Ukrainian politics and international rel ...

Get access to the context and additional materials

So you can understand the full picture and form your own opinion.
Get access for free
Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

Navigating Global Dynamics: Documentary Adaptation and Direction

Pandemic Roadblocks: Virtual Connections and Deferred Plans

Although the global health crisis temporarily stalled hands-on progress, it inadvertently deepened the documentary's narrative scope and preparation.

Political Tensions Rise: Russian Military Movements in 2021

As 2021 neared its end, the stark reality of escalating military posturing by Russia near the Ukrainian border sharpene ...

Here’s what you’ll find in our full summary

Registered users get access to the Full Podcast Summary and Additional Materials. It’s easy and free!
Start your free trial today

Navigating Global Dynamics: Documentary Adaptation and Direction

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • In 2021, Russia's military buildup near the Ukrainian border raised concerns internationally. This escalation of tensions was linked to the ongoing conflict between Russia and Ukraine. The increased Russian troop presence heightened fears of a potential military confrontati ...

Counterarguments

  • The global health crisis may have offered an opportunity for deeper narrative scope and preparation, but it could also have led to missed opportunities for on-the-ground reporting and capturing timely events, which are crucial for documentary filmmaking.
  • While the Russian military movements in 2021 did add urgency to the documentary, it's possible that this focus might have overshadowed other important themes or stories that were also deserving of attention in the documentary.
  • The assertion that Sean's team was forced to address the escalating military posturing by Russia suggests a lack of agency or choice; however, documentary filmmakers often make deliberate decisions about the narratives they pursue, and there could have been alternative ways ...

Get access to the context and additional materials

So you can understand the full picture and form your own opinion.
Get access for free
Exploring Sean Penn's Journey with President Zelensky | Real Ones Podcast

Groundwork in a Nation under Threat: Cultural Immersion and Conflict Insight

Cultural Exploration: Engaging with Ukraine’s Heritage and People

Sean’s team deeply engaged with Ukraine’s rich cultural heritage and resilient people, despite a missed in-person meeting with President Zelensky, which was thwarted by a critical Ukrainian intelligence operation focusing on the covert activities of the Wagner Group, highlighting the complexities and dangers surrounding them.

The Spirit of Ukraine: Resilience in the Face of Invasion

Upon returning to Ukraine with the threat of invasion at its zenith, Sean was captivated by the Ukrainian people's ...

Here’s what you’ll find in our full summary

Registered users get access to the Full Podcast Summary and Additional Materials. It’s easy and free!
Start your free trial today

Groundwork in a Nation under Threat: Cultural Immersion and Conflict Insight

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • The Wagner Group is a private military company with ties to Russia, known for its involvement in various conflicts. Ukrainian intelligence conducted an operation to gather information on the covert activities of the Wagner Group. This operation aimed to uncover any potential threats or destabilizing actions linked to the group's presence in Ukraine. The focus was on monitoring and understanding the activities and intentions of this paramilitary organization within Ukrainian territory.
  • The phrase "the threat of invasion at its zenith" means that the risk of an invasion was at its highest point or peak. This suggests that the possibility of an invasion occurring was most imminent or intense during this time. The use of "zenith" emphasizes the critical nature of the threat, indicating a peak level of concern or danger. The situation described implies a heightened state of readiness or tension in response to the loomi ...

Counterarguments

...

Get access to the context and additional materials

So you can understand the full picture and form your own opinion.
Get access for free

Create Summaries for anything on the web

Download the Shortform Chrome extension for your browser

Shortform Extension CTA